[Flyin'Dutch']

Now I know why I don't fit in. Better still - let's get Nick Farage to negotiate on our behalf? We'd be out of EASA within days. (No offence David)

I am old enough to remember that the UK IR pre JAR EASA was not a walk in the park and lead to the arrival of the IMCR.

[peterh337]

The UK IR was never a walk in the park, AFAICT, but there was that dead handy "700hr route".

Whenever you get together a bunch of old "UK IR" geezers, and you ask them how they did it, you find that most of them did it via the "700hr" concession.

I am also old enough to remember when the National Front were giving away a free pair of jackboots when you joined them

[fuzzy6988]

The IMCR seems to me, a dirty workaround to the "700hr" IR. The rating was suitable for the unique layout of UK airspace, a layout which kept all users equally unhappy and grew piecemeal over time.

What should have been done instead was create the CBM IR which we are seeing being proposed today.

[Timothy]

700 hour was more commonly used as a route to CPL than IR, ISTR.

[AbeamDotBe]

As having a FAA PPL/IR and a JAA PPL I like this proposal!

Question: what is the correct definition of "instrument flight time" as in [8. (d) have a minimum experience of at least 100 hours of instrument flight time as PIC on aeroplanes]

I vaguely remember a severe difference between the EASA definition (all flight time under IFR) and the FAA definition (only flight time in actual or simulated IMC). Is this correct? Where do I find the correct definition.

For me the difference is enourmous as when flying IFR, you do gather far more time under IFR then under actual IMC ...

Thank you for yrou help in clarifying this matter.

Abeam.be

[mo0g]

Could someone please clarify something for me - as I understand it we still have the "by April 2012" deadline for (probable) grandfather rights for IMCR holders.

For some reason I thought that would be by the END of April, but after having a brief discussion with a FTO they said there is a deadline of 31st March. Not entirely sure if that is assumed, there has been a dictat from the CAA, whether that applies to training and/or applications being received etc.

Anyhow, if there is a cutoff for training of 31st March that cuts down my time by >25% and I will almost certainly now need to take a week off work and finish off intensive.

Thanks

Mark

PS He did mention that this deadline will poss/prob be moved to June/July, and I am sort of debating whether to just stick with my weekly plan and if the CAA dont come through then c'est la vie.

[mo0g]

Supplementary question;

If I start IMCR training, and for some reason dont get the rating (run out of time etc), will the training hours count in full towards the EIR?

I believe the hours spent will count if you have the rating, but unsure if you didnt.

[nickwilcock]

Which FTO is peddling such nonsense?

NOTHING has been decided about the future of the UK IMCR at this stage.

[Irv Lee]

The way it's been explained is wrong, but in this economic climate, the idea of not taking money from pilots if the school can't guarantee some end result should be commended, but it highlights how sad it is that economic and possibly critical financial decisions have had to be made effectively with blindfolds on by many pilots, instuctors, and schools.

[mo0g]

Thanks Nick & Irv, it is as I suspected - when I plan my training with my proposed instructor I will bear that in mind, it seems it is (one of) their interpretations of "by April 2012", so I will go for the steady/regular slots and keep my week off in the back pocket just in case the CAA do stick to that deadline at the last minute.

With regards to Irv's economic comment - I agree, it seems like lunacy that the CAA have not issued some sort of interim guideline to FTOs, especially in olympic year where some will already be losing money.

[421C]

Question: what is the correct definition of "instrument flight time" as in [8. (d) have a minimum experience of at least 100 hours of instrument flight time as PIC on aeroplanes

It's in EASA Part FCL.010 Definitions: ‘Instrument flight time’ means the time during which a pilot is controlling an aircraft in flight solely by reference to instruments.

You are right that EASA and JAR FCL also use a "flight time under IFR" definition, but only for a different and specific purpose, qualifying to be an IR Instructor, where 800hrs flight time under IFR is needed.

Both PPL/IR and AOPA have commented in their CRT response that the 100hrs is excessive.
brgds
421C

[peterh337]

100hrs instrument time is way OTT.

For example I have only 150hrs instrument time (1400+hrs TT) plus 75hrs hood time. And that is after doing

- IMCR
- FAA IR
- JAA IR conversion
- flying a lot around Europe, IFR, and deliberately flying in a lot of cloud in the UK for practice

It appears certain that the 100hrs instrument time was demanded by FTOs, to prevent people doing the FAA CPL/IR (in the USA, obviously) and then coming back and doing a conversion course, using the CBM IR for the IR conversion route. The CPL/IR pilots still have to sit all 14 ATPL exams but the FTOs don't make much money from that

[joe-fbs]

IIRC, we should have had the EASA response / NPA by now. Does anyone close to the process know what the status is, please.