Polite discussion about EASA, the CAA, the ANO and the delights of aviation regulation.
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#1838112
DavidC wrote:
I would just highlight that for the EASA instrument rating, such as the CBIR, you must complete the training and take the IR skill test in an EASA member state.


Does this apply to ATO part of the training only or to flight instruction credit too? If it's the latter that would be quite unfortunate to say the least.


I believe it is just the IR skill test that must be conducted in an EASA member state. However it makes sense to familiarise with the local area, likely approaches and local procedures beforehand rather than just turning up on test day. It appears that some commercial schools have chosen to move all their EASA IR training abroad while others still do the initial stages in the UK.
#1838116
ORA.ATO.150 requires that 'familiarisation' and the IR Skill Test are taken 'in a member state'.

I will be tabling a proposal to amend this to read 'in airspace that complies with Single European Rules of the Air'. If successful, that would enable IR training and testing to be conducted in any of 41 Eurocontrol States rather than 31 EASA Member States.
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#1838263
nickwilcock wrote:ORA.ATO.150 requires that 'familiarisation' and the IR Skill Test are taken 'in a member state'.


That restriction applies only when IR training is provided by ATOs in third countries.

Applicants who hold a Part-FCL PPL/CPL, a valid ICAO Annex 1-compliant IR, and who have 50 hours of flight time under IFR as PIC on aeroplanes may be fully credited towards the CBM IR training course. Part-FCL appendix 6, Aa, 8.

If the applicant is credited in full then neither acclimatisation flying nor the IR skill test are required by ORA.ATO.150 to be done in one of the Member States.
#1838269
nickwilcock wrote:Nothing to do with airspace in which IFR flight is undertaken (as it would be for IR training and testing) - and in any case, it was an exemption which applied a couple of years ago when the UK was still an EASA MS!


It was also rejected as a valid exemption. Commission Implementing Decision (EU) 2019/1957 of 25 November 2019.
#1842179
I have promised to post an update once FOCA responds and here is the summary:

  • There is full credit up to 30 hours for instrument instruction outside ATO with EASA-licensed IRI-rated instructor regardless of plane registration or airspace.
  • (pleasant surprise!) Acclimatization training will not be needed for UK-based EASA certified ATO.
  • (even more pleasant surprise!) Skill test may be done in the UK provided that the ATO responsible for the training complies with FOCA's Examiner Deviation Guide (i.e. sends FOCA a list of examiners 2 weeks before the skill test, FOCA will probably pick one of those, but in theory can also designate a different one if it wishes).
  • For SEP revalidation it's fine too, but they also specifically mentioned the need of having the validation for flying the G-registered aircraft in the response for this point. I am not sure if this is just a kind reminder from them or if they will now require to submit that general validation from CAA together with the form and a copy of logbook pages (probably the former).
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