Polite discussion about EASA, the CAA, the ANO and the delights of aviation regulation.
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By Buzz53
#1589535
Well I have now had an email and a telephone chat with a gentleman from the BGA who seems to be their lead on this. He tells me that the status of TMG and self-launching sailplanes is identical and consequently as things stand it will NOT be possible to fly DG400/S10 etc on a UK licence after April 8th.

Alan (confused)
By Arclite01
#1589570
For me we are dealing with 2 things here:

1. That EASA have changed the goalposts and that due to a paperwork exercise and date on a bit of paper (arbitrary) after April people who don't have the correct bit of paper can no longer fly the aeroplanes that they have being flying for years perfectly safely. The people are the same, the aeroplanes are the same, the weather is the same, the sites are the same, the airspace is the same..............but the paper means all of this is irrelevant. I am one of the people affected. Come April I will most likely just throw it all up in the air and walk away.

2. Most people flying Motorgliders (whether TMG, SLMG or SLS) are usually either current or ex-glider pilots. A small amount of differences training would be more than adequate for conversion in most cases with the focus on glide ratio, airbrakes and large spans on the ground (taxi). In the US glider pilots can convert very quickly from sailplanes to MG's (various) on this very basis.

Why can't we ?

Arc
By low&slow
#1589589
EASA rules make it easier for glider pilots to fly powered gliders & TMGs than the CAA rules do. Adding a self launch endorsement or TMG privileges to an EASA sailplane licence is much easier than getting an NPPL SLMG.
By Arclite01
#1589614
The majority of RF5 are on EASA CofA (Non Annex 2) only a few on PtF (Annex 2)

There are actually very few Annex 2 Motorgliders at all so the fact that the NPPL SLMG remains valid is of little use/consolation :cry:

Arc
User avatar
By VRB_20kt
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1589626
Are you suggesting that DG400/S10 and the like will become orphaned as of April because there isn't a viable route to get LAPL(S) in time?
By Buzz53
#1589633
Orphaned seems a bit strong! I imagine there is still time to get a LAPL(S) sorted before then but if not then personally I won't be gutted if I can't fly for a little bit longer as one of my partners is already tooled up with EASA bumf. But it would be nice to have some clarity on the extension situation, I've now been told that there definitely is, and definitely isn't an extension in place for SSL. I don't think the BGA website is very helpful in this respect as I said before.

Alan
By Bathman
#1589635
And more regulatory daftness is that differences traing is rating specific so if you have tailwheel differences signed off on SEP it doesnt count on a TMG.
User avatar
By Cookie
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1589652
Have you had a look at the list of required differences in GM1 FCL.700 for TMG? You might be surprised... :wink:

Cookie
By Bathman
#1589665
No. Thank you.

But I would add that an instructor who is based in the same area as me and I might add is an LAA coach and he spoke to the CAA about this very matter. They told him that differences training is Class specific and that he would need further tailwheel differences training on TMG's despite holding such priviledges for SEP.
User avatar
By Cookie
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1589671
Differences training is class specific. However, if you look at EASA Part-FCL, GM1 FCL.700, you will see that there are no required differences within the TMG class. The same is true under national regulation for the SLMG class rating in ANO Schedule 8.

Easy Access Rules for Part-FCL - see GM1 FCL.700 on page 806/807

CAP 393 UK ANO - see Schedule 8 Part 2 Chapter 2

Cookie
By gopropilot
#1589876
Hi Guys,

Thanks to all who have responded and advised :)

I spoke to the CAA on the phone and at first didn't know what form but when I mentioned SRG1104 they said 'yeh' . I then asked about what evidence needed and fee.

I emailed across to FCLWEB certified copies of NPPL, ID and medical, SRG1104 that was all. I got the automated response saying it could take 6-8weeks for a response. I was surprised they said I could email all the forms, I thought it was via post or online. They said there would be no fee for this, can’t remember exactly what they said, something like I've already got the rating it’s just a case of adding it to my EASA licence...

Which I was obviously pleased about and mentioned that in the cover letter just in case they forget about no fee.(I left the card details bit blank, hope it doesn't get rejected because of that, I didn't ask for courier just 2nd class) I’ve also asked for a refund for the LAPL application, they said it would be poss but may take time. Guess I’ll have to chase that.
Just hope they accept the form and I’ve filled it out correctly.

Will post back once I know.
By BehyBill
#1589964
Thanks gopropilot for getting back with the feeback, I have advised some of the peers to go that route as I did instead of hoping for a pushback on the april 18 date, these days it is better keep two sets of paperwork one for EUland and one UKland :D
By gopropilot
#1593468
Hi all. Have a reply. Not what I thought would happen :( Is this advice correct? Shall I do what they say or have they got it wrong ?


Dear Mr ...

Thank you for your recent licensing application for the issue of a TMG rating.

Your application has now been assessed and has found to fall short of the following:-

As you are applying for the issue of a TMG rating we require a completed Application for Issue of a Single or Multi-Pilot Class or Type Rating Including Powered Lift Aircraft (SRG1119A) to be submitted to us at your earliest convenience. Please accept our apologies that you were misadvised over the phone, as you already hold a Part-FCL PPL we are unable to accept the SRG1104 submitted.
Please note a fee of £121 is applicable for the issue of the TMG rating so please ensure the payment details section is completed.

To ensure any other ratings endorsed on your PPL are updated on our system please provide us with a certified copy of your current licence.
For more information on who can certify the copy of your licence please visit our website at: http://www.caa.co.uk/General-aviation/P ... certified/