Polite discussion about EASA, the CAA, the ANO and the delights of aviation regulation.
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By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1547554
nickwilcock wrote:Maybe I should raise this with EASA? It would be interesting to watch a certain rulemaker spitting their dummy at the idea, if nothing else!


Nah, thanks, it would be more useful if they could embed LAPL privileges in the PPL so people can continue to fly with a LAPL Medical once their Class 2 has expired.

It would be a benefit to a great number of pilots whereas moving up from a LAPL to a PPL is a very small number of people only.

Unless lobbying resource and capacity has gone up considerably it may be best to go for those things which benefit most people.
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By Irv Lee
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1547672
Essential from April 8th 2018,
A) continue use of national licences and ratings in national airspace whether EASA aircraft or not
B) continue national licence bridging rules which at the moment cover a number of EASA private flying problems with smoke, mirrors, and merkins. (A word not in my text prediction surprisingly, might be spelled with another "i" not "e", someone here will know)
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By Cookie
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1547876
Nah, thanks, it would be more useful if they could embed LAPL privileges in the PPL so people can continue to fly with a LAPL Medical once their Class 2 has expired.


From NPA 2014-29(A) and subsequent Opinion 05/2017, a future amendment to EASA Aircrew Regulation is expected Q2/2018 to allow this:

FCL.205.A PPL(A)—privileges

(a) The privileges of holders of a PPL(A) are to act without remuneration as PIC or co-pilots of aeroplanes or TMGs engaged in non-commercial operations and exercise all privileges of holders of an LAPL(A).


Explanatory text states:

FCL.205.A PPL(A) — privileges

In (a), the exercise of all the privileges of the holder of an LAPL(A) is included in the privileges for the holder of a PPL(A) to avoid unnecessary administrative burden on GA pilots when they do no longer fulfil the conditions for a Class 2 medical certificate, but those for an LAPL medical certificate. With this amendment, GA pilots do not need to have an LAPL(A) issued but may use their PPL(A) as an LAPL(A).


https://www.easa.europa.eu/document-library/opinions/opinion-052017

Agree with Irv above wrt national licences.

Cookie
Flyin'Dutch' liked this
#1547879
Cookie wrote:
Nah, thanks, it would be more useful if they could embed LAPL privileges in the PPL so people can continue to fly with a LAPL Medical once their Class 2 has expired.


From NPA 2014-29(A) and subsequent Opinion 05/2017, a future amendment to EASA Aircrew Regulation is expected Q2/2018 to allow this:

FCL.205.A PPL(A)—privileges

(a) The privileges of holders of a PPL(A) are to act without remuneration as PIC or co-pilots of aeroplanes or TMGs engaged in non-commercial operations and exercise all privileges of holders of an LAPL(A).


Explanatory text states:

FCL.205.A PPL(A) — privileges

In (a), the exercise of all the privileges of the holder of an LAPL(A) is included in the privileges for the holder of a PPL(A) to avoid unnecessary administrative burden on GA pilots when they do no longer fulfil the conditions for a Class 2 medical certificate, but those for an LAPL medical certificate. With this amendment, GA pilots do not need to have an LAPL(A) issued but may use their PPL(A) as an LAPL(A).


https://www.easa.europa.eu/document-library/opinions/opinion-052017

Agree with Irv above wrt national licences.

Cookie


In that situation can you also use the LAPL currency rules or do you still need to revalidate?

MM
#1547897
MM, as we understand it, revalidation of the SEP Class Rating won't be required if you are using embedded LAPL privileges....

BUT

If you subsequently decide to revert to PPL privileges and your Class Rating has expired, you will have to renew it by Proficiency Check even if you've flown hundreds of hours using LAPL privileges. Bonkers I agree, but 'Befehl ist Befehl'....that's the way of €urocracy.

So I recommend that, even if flying on LAPL privileges, you fly within SEP Class Rating validity requirements and keep it valid unless you are 100% certain that you won't ever need the full PPL.
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User avatar
By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1547907
nickwilcock wrote: Bonkers I agree, but 'Befehl ist Befehl'....that's the way of €urocracy.


Nick,

For you, as someone who profiles themselves on here as an official representative of AOPA UK, I think that your choice of language is particularly inappropriate on a public forum which amongst its readers and contributors has people from all over Europe and beyond.

I am surprised that you think bandying around stereotypes is helpful when lobbying for the progress of GA in the UK and Europe.

My AOPA UK membership recently expired and the decision not to renew was in part based on the way that AOPA has been profiling itself, and at times not at all, in relation to matters GA recently.
#1547912
nickwilcock wrote:MM, as we understand it, revalidation of the SEP Class Rating won't be required if you are using embedded LAPL privileges....

BUT

If you subsequently decide to revert to PPL privileges and your Class Rating has expired, you will have to renew it by Proficiency Check even if you've flown hundreds of hours using LAPL privileges. Bonkers I agree, but 'Befehl ist Befehl'....that's the way of €urocracy.

So I recommend that, even if flying on LAPL privileges, you fly within SEP Class Rating validity requirements and keep it valid unless you are 100% certain that you won't ever need the full PPL.


Thanks.

At present I have to do a PC every year no matter how many hours flown, so doing a PC to switch back to PPL is no great issue to me. Finding a convenient examiner with the relevant type rating is an issue. So what you describe works for me - I could fly with LAPL privileges (identical to PPL) doing my 6 hours and annual flight with an instructor and simply do a PC to revalidate the PPL(H) if ever i needed it. Splendid. :D

MM