For help, advice and discussion about stuff not related to aviation. Play nice: no religion, no politics and no axe grinding please.
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User avatar
By Flyingfemme
#1884039
Two months in and I still don't actually have an electricity account set up..............Shell tell me that they are "very busy". Poor dears. At the start of this they emailed me with some fearsome prices that they said I would be paying - one single rate when I have an Economy 7 meter. Last month they emailed to say, "Don't worry", you will still be on an Economy 7 tariff. But didn't bother to tell me what that was. Nor have they asked for any readings. By the time they get round to it the bill could be several hundred pounds and many people won't be able to come up with that instantly.
By classgee
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1884043
And of course the customers who stayed with responsible suppliers who had sustainable business models still don’t know how much will be added to their bills for the next few years to subsidise the customers who were rescued from their cheap deals…
By riverrock
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1884050
who is getting subsidised?
Bulb is the only company so far that is to be run as a going concern by the gov, so I guess there could be a subsidy argument for it.
User avatar
By Flyingfemme
#1884092
classgee wrote:And of course the customers who stayed with responsible suppliers who had sustainable business models still don’t know how much will be added to their bills for the next few years to subsidise the customers who were rescued from their cheap deals…

I think the boot may be on the other foot........all the customers of the companies who went bust are having their bills doubled (or worse) instantly, with no possibility of getting a decent fixed rate deal for the foreseeable, while those with companies who haven't gone bust are able to keep their cosy deals until they expire. Who's subsidising who?
By classgee
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1884101
Flyingfemme wrote:Who's subsidising who?


Supplier of last resort:

The costs of taking on customers from failed suppliers can be recovered via an industry levy that filters through to consumers’ energy bills. Ofgem said these costs include “the ability for a supplier to also claim for a reasonable profit”.
...
The estimated £1bn cost of rescuing customers from suppliers that have failed since the start of August is expected to rise as more companies collapse. It will eventually fall on consumers.



Basically all consumers will end up sharing the pain of a broken model. Including those who never switched from BG since privatisation and never gained a penny by doing business with the minnows that are falling like dominos at the moment...
User avatar
By skydriller
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1884112
Perhaps a daft question:

Im a little confused as to why, in a free market, if your energy contract has been broken by your supplier (going out of business), you are not free to find another? What ties you to Shell??
By Colonel Panic
#1884119
classgee wrote:Basically all consumers will end up sharing the pain of a broken model. Including those who never switched from BG since privatisation and never gained a penny by doing business with the minnows that are falling like dominos at the moment...

Ah yes, those were the days; British Gas, the GPO, SEEBOARD and one Water Co. Even I can remember my parents being quoted 6-9 months for a phone line to be activated (the equipment was already there).
eltonioni liked this
By johnm
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1884130
The problem was always lack of investment by HMG. Private investment on the treasury Netco Servco model worked a treat on telecoms because the internet was just taking off and there was a genuine market.

In the utilities there is not that scenario and the lack of investment is not fixed, indeed it’s arguably worse because dividends now figure on the cost base.
kanga liked this
By A4 Pacific
#1884135
classgee wrote:And of course the customers who stayed with responsible suppliers who had sustainable business models still don’t know how much will be added to their bills for the next few years to subsidise the customers who were rescued from their cheap deals…


You need to check your sanctimony there classgee.

When the government’s energy price cap is utterly incompatible with current wholesale energy prices in this hyper-volatile market, then NOBODY has a ‘“sustainable business model”!

No matter how good their business models, new entrants will inevitably have less liquidity. (Bulb was not a rogue entrant!) Should the situation progress a few months longer then unless your provider is HMG, perhaps even your supplier could decline to honour it’s contract with you, because they are currently subsidising your energy consumption!

Then what?
User avatar
By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1884158
skydriller wrote:Perhaps a daft question:

Im a little confused as to why, in a free market, if your energy contract has been broken by your supplier (going out of business), you are not free to find another? What ties you to Shell??


The scheme protects your advance payments.

Otherwise if the supplier goes bust you are still liable for the full outstanding amount of what you have consumed so far.
User avatar
By Tall_Guy_In_a_PA28
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1884164
skydriller wrote:Perhaps a daft question:

Im a little confused as to why, in a free market, if your energy contract has been broken by your supplier (going out of business), you are not free to find another? What ties you to Shell??

Because it is not a free market, it is a highly regulated one. Currently no energy company will voluntarily take on new customers on anything other than highly inflated fixed-rate contracts, as variable rates are capped and currently loss-making. Forcing companies to take on 'orphans' is a good thing, but the system seems to be overloaded per FlyingFemme's experience.

The idea is that as soon as you are contacted by the appointed supplier you can request the lowest tariff for your circumstances or to switch elsewhere. The regulator expects this to take a week or two but that is clearly not happening.

Shell actually had some pretty good deals pre-crisis and I nearly switched.
User avatar
By skydriller
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1884167
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:The scheme protects your advance payments.
Oh, so the reason these contracts were so low in price was because customers paid up front??? hmmm... now, what is it we always tell people about flying training??

I have not ever done that with my energy bills, they go up/down with usage. EDF sends me a nice yearly chart that even has average temperature on it which almost exactly follows my usage.

Regards, SD..
User avatar
By Propwash
#1884188
Things generally work better where any government involvement is either non-existent or kept to an absolute minimum. I have never understood why there should be a government imposed price cap on energy prices in a market which is supposed to be competitive. Left alone, surely market forces would self-regulate as consumers ditched uncompetitive companies? At least then, in unusual times like these where global prices are so volatile, companies would be more likely to accept customers who are forced to switch rather view them as additional liabilities.

I always thought Ronald Reagan had the right idea about government meddling in things.

PW
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