For help, advice and discussion about stuff not related to aviation. Play nice: no religion, no politics and no axe grinding please.
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By StratoTramp
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1875098
townleyc wrote:On an earlier comment, perhaps we should think back to The Last and First men - Olaf Stapledon

KE


Had to look it up despite liking a bit of old sci-fi.

I would definitely put myself in the category of "Baboon-like Submen"
#1875110
@Colonel Panic,I believe the growth in electric sales is also driven by tax savings, with about 50% of sales being company car buyers taking advantage of lower BIK payments. Unlike the con that was hybrid, at least the electric vehicles will deliver the intended environmental benefit. :thumright:

Although electric sales are outstripping ICE, they remain behind 'target' as %age of total.
By johnm
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1875112
It seems that very few electric vehicles are bought by end users they are leased it seems. I assume that's because their future value is uncertain and capital costs relatively high. I think I'd have to look at the implications of a 3 year old as I have with ICE over the last 20 years.
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By Flying_john
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1875115
I'm a sample of One.

I have had 6 EV's since 2009, everyone has been owned outright. This way you are not swelling the pockets of a 3rd party/finance company/commission payments etc.

No such thing as a free lunch !
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By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1875117
Yup that is correct John.

When I was looking at a replacement when the lease for the previous EV came up I of course saw some second hand stuff; the sales people said that they cannot shift htem for love nor money because they would of course come to the end of their battery warranty period soon after being sold
#1875121
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:because they would of course come to the end of their battery warranty period soon after being sold

Really? My understanding is that batteries are generally warranted for 7-8 years, and AIUI (never having had one) leases tend to be 2-3-4 years.
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By Flying_john
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1875122
Very generous warranty periods on the battery for Nissans. Not sure what they are like on some of the newcomers.

Currently in UK Nissan has 8 years / 100,000 mile warranty on battery. I read that some of the earlier models, if battery gets a bit low capacity, they upgrade to higher capacity too.

Latest new Leaf cost me £24k. As said before, for companies there is zero BIK 1st year, 1% 2nd year 2% 3rd year etc. It seems that I could sell it to WBAC for more than I paid for it at the moment.

Previous one was a lower model £18k ran it for 4yrs and sold for £13.5k. During that time 25000 miles saving in the order of £3500 in fuel (compared to petrol car at 40mpg) and £450 in road tax. So net zero over life of the car before I consider the much reduced servicing costs, cleaner running etc. I suspect the 2nd owner will reap better benefits as their starting cost will be lower and the car will be further down the depreciation curve.

I'm not say an EV is a panacea for all travel needs but with 150 mile real world range and a huge number of recharge points for that longer journey it fits the bill for my needs.
By johnm
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1875123
Colonel Panic wrote:
johnm wrote:It seems that very few electric vehicles are bought by end users they are leased it seems.

Source?


Anecdotal, I freely confess, everybody I know who has one either leased it themselves or got it as a leased company vehicle....
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By Rob P
#1875124
"Owning" by way of a lease (usually a PCP) was the recommendation in the early days of EV to guard against the uncertainties of battery degradation.

All leased vehicles are not company cars.

Rob P
By johnm
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1875125
Colonel Panic wrote:Really? My understanding is that batteries are generally warranted for 7-8 years,


That's interesting, a typical 3 year old ICE comes with 6 month warranty with option to extend through an insurance arrangement so this looks quite a lot better.

I am now at the point where electric might well be on the list when next I have to buy a car. I have power in the garage, but only a standard ring main, is that adequate for charging over night typically??
#1875126
Rob P wrote:
Miscellaneous wrote: ...the UK's best selling car through Sept, the Tesla 3?


That's an amazing achievement for an EV. It looks as if the future has arrived. In fact EVs made up over 15% of the total by volume, presumably more by value.

If you add hybrids the total with some form of electric drive it reaches about 38% by volume

Rob P

You know what they say about lies and statistics though Rob. Car sales are on their arris and every manufacturer seems to have at least twelvty different models in their lineup with another sevonee variants of each, which sort of dilutes their ability to have Ford Escort type model sales.

Quick unscientific check of big numbers:
1990 Ford Escort sales +2m in UK
2020 Tesla total sales 0.5m worldwide.

1990 worldwide car sales 40m
2018 worldwide car sales 95m
2020 worldwide car sales 79m
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