[eltonioni]

It’s looking like Brits will only ones allowed to travel around Europe this summer. Aus / NZ too if their tardy vaccination programs are anything to go by.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/ ... t-yet-used

[romille]

Seems like the Germans might be about to change the guidance on the Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-56227171

[johnm]

It's interesting to see that the Germans are confining themselves to decisions based on positive scientific testing and analysis only. The original AZ trials didn't have many old folk involved so the data is limited. It's clearly safe in practice as many in the UK have been given it with few reported issues, the question is does it work effectively for old folk and the Scottish study seems to answer that question in the affirmative.

[Keveng]

If the man six doors down has been vaccinated in England before travelling to France he’s presenting bugger all risk and frankly you’re all going to have to get used to it PDQ, or stay in hiding just in case.

You know this is fundamentally wrong !
Even after the vaccine you can still catch it and spread it . The vaccine just allows your body to fight the virus more efficiently (if it recognises the variant you are infected with )

[A4 Pacific]

It’s looking like Brits will only ones allowed to travel around Europe this summer.

It’s always been the case that the European tourist industry is very significantly dependent upon British tourists. Countries such as Greece, Spain and Portugal will be clamouring to attract whatever travellers they can. The EU will move heaven and earth to facilitate it!

But it’s for HMG to decide whether it will be sensible for the UK to allow leisure mixing between countries who are struggling to roll out vaccinations to their own populations and/or control the virus. Particularly bearing in mind many younger people who may wish to travel abroad are unlikely to be accommodated in the UK vaccination program until later in the year.

Or are we happy to accept only those with proof of two effective vaccinations may travel? What will be the quarantine arrangements? For example Portugal (including Madeira and the Azores) is still a red flag country requiring airport hotel quarantine!

There are some interesting decisions to be made.

HMG have so far advised against booking foreign (or even domestic?) holidays this year. There may be a reason? Of course mockdown restrictions won’t be fully lifted even in the UK until the 21st June at the earliest.

I think it’s a little premature to suggest swarms of British holidaymakers will be sunning themselves on European beaches this summer?

[skydriller]

Even after the vaccine you can still catch it and spread it .

Source to back up that statement? Everything I have read so far suggests that it is not yet known to be true or false and is only now being studied as the vaccination rollout expands.

[A4 Pacific]

Even after the vaccine you can still catch it and spread it .

Source to back up that statement? Everything I have read so far suggests that it is not yet known to be true or false and is only now being studied as the vaccination rollout expands.

Well it’s crystal clear a proportion can still become infected even after being vaccinated. It’s hardly unlikely you can infect others if you are infected yourself.

[johnm]

For the moment at least, the UK is not on the list of 3rd countries where restrictions on non-essential travel should start to be lifted. So booking a holiday across the Channel might be seen as a bit brave as yet....

The list is:

1. AUSTRALIA
2. NEW ZEALAND
3. RWANDA
4. SINGAPORE
5. SOUTH KOREA
6. THAILAND
7. CHINA*

Hong Kong
Macao

There are some detailed qualifications on arrivals from China, Hong Kong and Macao

[kanga]

It’s looking like Brits will only ones allowed to travel around Europe this summer.

It’s always been the case that the European tourist industry is very significantly dependent upon British tourists. Countries such as Greece, Spain and Portugal ..

.. and, in the Mediterranean, upon German and Scandinavian ones. There are islands where there are (or used to be) 'national days', often different on different but nearby islands. Thus, ISTR at Heraklion, Wednesday was 'Brit day': in the morning charter airliners would arrive in the morning from lots of UK regional airports and disgorge their Brit 7- or 14-day package tourists, and in the afternoon the same airliners would return to the same UK airports taking package tourists back. Thursday was German day, and Tuesday was Scandinavian day. This would be further exemplified by tourist guide leaflets in different languages in different racks in the same hotels; and the new arrivals getting their briefs from the company rep in the hotel lounge would be in different languages each day. Fun to eavesdrop Meanwhile Rhodes had different days for each national group.

It had the advantage that a suitcase put onto the wrong homebound airliner would probably end up at least in the right country

[MikeE]

It's interesting to see that the Germans are confining themselves to decisions based on positive scientific testing and analysis only. The original AZ trials didn't have many old folk involved so the data is limited. It's clearly safe in practice as many in the UK have been given it with few reported issues, the question is does it work effectively for old folk and the Scottish study seems to answer that question in the affirmative.

I believe there was ample scientific evidence that the Oxford vaccine worked effectively for older people before the Scottish study, which simply confirms it . The vaccine trials showed a similar strong immune response in those people over 65 who were involved as in those who were younger. As I understand it JCVI approved use of the Oxford vaccine for over 65s at least partly on the basis of the protection offered by that immune response even though there weren't many over 65s enrolled (only 2 out of 660 caught the virus) in those trials. The scientific and medical community has considerable knowledge of vaccine use and knows what what to look for to understand what is likely to be effective and what isn't.
In any event, the European Medicines Agency recognised this and recommended use of the OA vaccine for all age groups, but for some reason the politicians disagreed. Now there are large numbers of people in Europe who will be waiting for the 'right' vaccine to be available and, no doubt, sadly some will die.

Regards

Mike

[Flyin'Dutch']

I believe there was ample scientific evidence that the Oxford vaccine worked effectively for older people before the Scottish study, which simply confirms it .

Mike

The Scottish study indicates that there is a good response - AZ themselves stated that too few people in the over 65 category had been part of the trial and therefore no absolute conclusions could be drawn.

Now there are large numbers of people in Europe who will be waiting for the 'right' vaccine to be available and, no doubt, sadly some will die.

Mike

Yup totally bonkers and a waste of vaccine and lives.

The strong jingoistic and anti European rhetoric by UK red tops and politicians alike has no doubt a role too; having turned the UK from being a cool place to one inhabited by loons and whereas in the past something coming from Oxford would have been desirable there are now folks who look different upon that.

Sadly uneducated people are not the preserve of the UK.

There is also a significant part of the German population who have very strong roots to the east and some of them want the Sputnik stuff, some traveling to family in Russia to go and get it.

[malcolmfrost]

I struggle with the concept that back in September, the AZ vaccine would have been effective but now I am 65 it magically becomes ineffective!! (but only if I lived in Germany)

[Propwash]

The strong jingoistic and anti European rhetoric by UK red tops and politicians alike has no doubt a role too; having turned the UK from being a cool place to one inhabited by loons and whereas in the past something coming from Oxford would have been desirable there are now folks who look different upon that.

I realise that it is irresistibly tempting for lots of people to place blame for everything bad or unpleasant in the world on the shoulders of the UK, but I am really struggling to see how, even allowing for the strident headlines of redtops, the decision, taken purely at a political level on the continent, to deny protection as quickly as possible for people at risk there, is any fault at all of the UK or anyone in it. We all know what is behind this shameless political posturing, but it only harms people there not here. Perhaps some of the erstwhile opponents of the UK going its own way may start to understand why so many here disagree with them, and see things in a new light. Putting politics above the lives of people is what totalitarian regimes tend to do. *Shrugs shoulders*

PW

[Miscellaneous]

Just watched the Canelo fight which was held in the Hard Rock stadium in Florida. For all the use the masks in view were one could be forgiven for thinking that covid has all but got up and left the State.

England lost again yesterday to Wales in the Six Nations, that's a lot of matches with very close contact in snotty, sweaty conditions.

Yet I am forbidden from leaving home, going flying and returning home with zero contact with anyone.

Totalitarian, let me just think @Propwash?

[A4 Pacific]

Flyin'Dutch' wrote:
The strong jingoistic and anti European rhetoric by UK red tops and politicians alike has no doubt a role too; having turned the UK from being a cool place to one inhabited by loons and whereas in the past something coming from Oxford would have been desirable there are now folks who look different upon that.

Like Propwash, I too see the ‘jingoism’ and petulance emanating not from the UK, but from EU leaders such as Macron. Costing lives purely to cover for the incompetence and interference of the EU. Alongside the determination from some quarters that Brexit must not be allowed to succeed!