For help, advice and discussion about stuff not related to aviation. Play nice: no religion, no politics and no axe grinding please.
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User avatar
By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895582
eltonioni wrote:Continental Europe has always been bedevilled with autocrats who wish themselves to be dictators. Some of them get the chance but they all overreach, such is the ultimate nature of fascism.


Sorry, I have been to specsavers but cannot see who the autocrats are in France and Germany, less still how they overreach.

Can you help by spelling it out in words of single syllables?
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By TopCat
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895584
Spooky wrote:
TopCat wrote:
Spooky wrote:Good video here on natural immunity being found to be equal to vaccination :thumleft:

By "good video", I presume you mean he agrees with you?


By that comment, I presume he disagrees with you?

Well you presume wrong.

I don't yet have an opinion on how well he in particular is representing the primary literature, although I've recently seen one of my usual sources accusing him of misrepresentation. I'll get to that in time.

I've also read from numerous sources in the literature, that 'natural' immunity (as if vaccine-induced immunity is somehow unnatural :roll: ) is not equal to vaccination, and, more to the point, 'natural' immunity plus vaccination is far superior to either on its own.

Unfortunately, I don't have time to continuously drink from the firehose of misinformation, and as I don't rely on the confirmation bias from my favourite YouTubers, it takes me a little more time than YouTube 'researchers' to come to a view.
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By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895585
Spooky wrote:https://youtu.be/25-iJKPA1CA

Good video here on natural immunity being found to be equal to vaccination :thumleft:


There is more to the study than just the one pretty graph in that video.

Previous infection alone protects better against the delta variant than vaccination alone. No argument there.

However the best protection is for those who have both had covid and have been fully vaccinated.

The issue is that in the group of vaccinated, without previous proven infection, there are of course those who would not have made it during a natural infection.
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By flybymike
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895617
Here’s a good letter from The Telegraph.
By “good” I mean that I agree with it.

SIR – If anything is representative of our muddled thinking in the face of the pandemic it is the mandatory mask (report, January 22).

Face masks serve chiefly as a constant reminder to us all to be afraid of social interaction and of normal human contact. As a hospital doctor, I find it deeply frustrating that I have to have important, sometimes devastating discussions when my face is half hidden. In so doing I make real human connection and trust almost impossible. The mask insidiously prevents us from healing after the pain of the past two years. We need to resume normal behaviour: the risk that is associated with coronavirus needs to be accepted as part of life.

Children are learning to be afraid of interaction. Adults are not communicating, and are suffering isolation and mental distress as a result. Steamed glasses for those with impaired vision and an inability to lip read for those who are deaf are two of the overlooked but harmful effects of mask-wearing.

It is time the small transmissibility benefit of mask-wearing was properly weighed up against the damaging parallel harms, and dispensed with. The mask is not protecting us, it is oppressing us.

David Hildick-Smith
Professor of Cardiology
Brighton & Sussex University Hospitals
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By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895629
Oppressing - no less.

He needs to give his head a good wobble.

What I do agree with, lucky him, is that it is necessary to have some good research done into the effectivity of wearing masks, types and in which circumstances.

I would not be surprised in the least if there are situations whereby the wearing of masks turns out to be little more than dressing up, and other situations whereby the wearing thereof makes a significant difference in the transmission of viruses and thereby infectiousness.

If at the same time we can have some decent research in how to deal with a surge in demand for health care services at times of a pandemic without it costing the earth and having a massive impact on life as we know it, then that would be wonderful.

As a variation on the strap line, 'if you think safety is expensive, try having an accident' I suggest: 'think preparation is expensive, try being unprepared'
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#1895697
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:
eltonioni wrote:Continental Europe has always been bedevilled with autocrats who wish themselves to be dictators. Some of them get the chance but they all overreach, such is the ultimate nature of fascism.


Sorry, I have been to specsavers but cannot see who the autocrats are in France and Germany, less still how they overreach.

Can you help by spelling it out in words of single syllables?


Oh come on FD, you're teasing me by ignoring Macron. :wink: And the generals. And Macron's opposition candidates. And a quarter of the French population apparently. We're way off topic, but since you asked this article popped up on The Times' website.

One in four French people would be happy for the army to run the country and two in five would welcome an unelected “strongman” as leader, according to a poll highlighting the fragility of democracy in the run-up to the presidential election.

The survey by OpinionWay for Cevipof, the Parisian political research institute, underlines a growing distrust with democratic institutions and suggests that France offers fertile ground for populism, with 65 per cent of the 10,500 respondents judging the country’s political class to be “on the whole corrupt”.

The first round of the presidential election is scheduled for April 10, with a run-off vote two weeks later if no candidate wins a majority.

The survey hints at the delicate nature of democracy in a country whose history has been marked by swings between popular uprisings and autocratic clampdowns imposed by figures such as Napoleon Bonaparte or Philippe Pétain, whose regime collaborated with the Nazis during the Second World War.

A total of 27 per cent of respondents said it would be a good thing for the army to run the country. This represented a 7 per cent increase since May last year, when a petition signed by retired and serving members of the armed forces warned that a military coup might be necessary to halt a crime wave that it attributed to Muslim immigrants.

The respondents were also asked whether they thought it a good idea for the country to be run “by a strongman who does not have to worry about either parliament or elections”. A total of 39 per cent said it would, up five points compared with May.

A total of 52 per cent said it would be good for experts to replace the elected government.


https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/one- ... -99vms8n6p

I appreciate that's quite normal on much of the Continent, I just didn't appreciate that saying it was especially controversial.


Shall we move on? :) I hear that the Dutch are ditching the daft rules.
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User avatar
By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895717
eltonioni wrote: We're way off topic, but since you asked this article popped up on The Times' website.


A total of 52 per cent said it would be good for experts to replace the elected government.



I appreciate that's quite normal on much of the Continent, I just didn't appreciate that saying it was especially controversial.



The irony.............

I am sure you appreciate that your explanation brought out a laugh out loud moment.

:D :D
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#1895745
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:
eltonioni wrote: We're way off topic, but since you asked this article popped up on The Times' website.


A total of 52 per cent said it would be good for experts to replace the elected government.



I appreciate that's quite normal on much of the Continent, I just didn't appreciate that saying it was especially controversial.



The irony.............

I am sure you appreciate that your explanation brought out a laugh out loud moment.

:D :D


Did you have the laugh over a congenial cappuccino with your unvaccinated pals at the café?

No? There's the difference. Needlessly and cruelly eliminating the most basic civil liberties of a sub group has once again been normalised in some places. History repeats itself all too often and people think they are on the right side of it at the time, only for their decedents to be aghast at what they did to others.
#1895751
Today's "More or Less" explores (inter alia) the much argued (arguably misrepresented) issue of the stats behind 'Deaths with Covid' and 'Deaths from Covid'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0013r9w
#1895753
kanga wrote:Today's "More or Less" explores (inter alia) the much argued (arguably misrepresented) issue of the stats behind 'Deaths with Covid' and 'Deaths from Covid'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0013r9w


Also a discussion on how placebos have become stronger.

Just saying.



On the died with / of Covid section, this MoL is another episode where they have set there own conclusion before doing the working out.
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User avatar
By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895779
eltonioni wrote:No? There's the difference. Needlessly and cruelly eliminating the most basic civil liberties of a sub group has once again been normalised in some places. History repeats itself all too often and people think they are on the right side of it at the time, only for their decedents to be aghast at what they did to others.


Matthew 7:3

Apologies for brevity; don't want to miss the Wednesday lunchtime comedy show.

Back later.
#1895782
eltonioni wrote:Needlessly and cruelly eliminating the most basic civil liberties of a sub group has once again been normalised in some places. History repeats itself all too often and people think they are on the right side of it at the time, only for their decedents to be aghast at what they did to others.


A day before we arrive at the 77th anniversary of the freeing of the prisoners in Auschwitz, it might be worth just keeping a bit of perspective here. The loss of civil liberties around the world due to covid are hardly something that our descendants are likely to view in anything like the same manner. Yes, restrictions have been imposed, but from a stance of well intentioned paternalism.

It is a bit like having your cake and eating it (around, say, a cabinet table). There are bigger things to worry about.
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