For help, advice and discussion about stuff not related to aviation. Play nice: no religion, no politics and no axe grinding please.
#1783821
Reading about the rescue effort re the aircraft that came down I wonder should there be a limit? For info I checked the distance to Inverness and Fort William, 116 miles and 110 miles, respectively. Although not printed, there was an ambulance crew in attendance too.

Press and Journal
Press and Journal wrote:Two dogs have been rescued from the water at a Skye beauty spot.

Two fire crews attended the world-famous Fairy Pools this afternoon after receiving a call from police around 3.50pm.

The crews from Dunvegan and Portree provided assistance to safely rescue the dogs from the water.

A fire service spokeswoman said the dogs are “safe and well”.

The spokeswoman said two water rescue teams from Fort William and Inverness had also been tasked, however, were stood down en route.
#1783841
Maybe the rescue teams were bored from the lack of tourists over recent months and welcomed the opportunity to do something...ANYTHING! But, for a couple of dogs? I'd have told their owners to get on with it themselves or call a vet.
#1783844
When we had a (minor) house fire I stopped the fire crew going up to the upper floor to go and get a sleeping cat - I got some bad looks for being cruel, from the crew but cat is not worth risking human life.

Mind you they also gave mrs FD looks of disdain for having got a kitchen fire; she put them right in no uncertain terms as it was my fault that grilling burgers had gone pretty wrong!
#1783849
Personally I consider it totally unacceptable to have so many crews, 5 (excluding police), coming from so far and wide at significant financial cost and being away from station, not to mention the risks of running blue lights, for a couple of dogs. If the local firecrews couldn't rescue them then a local crofter with a rifle would be the answer.
#1783850
rf3flyer wrote:Maybe the rescue teams were bored from the lack of tourists over recent months and welcomed the opportunity to do something...ANYTHING! But, for a couple of dogs? I'd have told their owners to get on with it themselves or call a vet.


I still hold the station record for number of dogs rescued from my time in the RNLI. Both times our turn out prevented owners entering water to rescue their pets.
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By JAFO
#1783858
@Sooty25 makes a very good point. By getting trained individuals to carry out the rescue you limit the possibility of untrained owners and bystanders getting into trouble by trying to effect a rescue themselves.

Personally, I wouldn't put a financial or resource limit on rescuing any animal, I just wouldn't put human life at risk and by travelling this distance they may have averted that.
#1783867
JAFO wrote:@Sooty25 makes a very good point. By getting trained individuals to carry out the rescue you limit the possibility of untrained owners and bystanders getting into trouble by trying to effect a rescue themselves.

Not so much in this case. If anyone was going to take the risk I would suggest they would have before the police arrived. Given the police called the fire service they were there to prevent the owners being silly.

Sooty25 wrote:what is the actual cost?

Not all about financial cost, although it is a consideration. That said the variable costs for this rescue would not be insignificant.

Sooty25 wrote:physical assets are already paid for.

Agreed the capital costs are, but there's more to it than that.

Sooty25 wrote:Crews are either salaried or volunteers.

So we are down to diesel.

Fire crews would be retained. That means they get paid a retainer and the going rate when called out. From recollection they go once 6 have turned up. Two crews (12 personnel) each from 20 plus miles away.

Cops, salaried.

Ambulance crew salaried.

Mountain Rescue, volunteers.

Assumed Coast Guard x 2 units from 2.5 hrs away, salaried? Don;t know the answer to that one.

Two bigger considerations are;

All these units are unavailable for the duration of the calls.

There is risk to blue light operations, particularly on single track roads.

Whichever way I consider it I cannot conclude it was an appropriate level of response. :naughty:

EDIT: and then there is the cost to businesses where the fire crews, mountain rescue etc work.
#1783874
The joy of emergency services is that they turn out without making a moral judgement call. Otherwise why should they bother launching for some half-wit who forgot to put fuel in his PA28 before he headed out for a hamburger.

Long may they keep turning out for both man and beast.



Flyin'Dutch' wrote:When we had a (minor) house fire I stopped the fire crew going up to the upper floor to go and get a sleeping cat - I got some bad looks for being cruel, from the crew but cat is not worth risking human life.

Mind you they also gave mrs FD looks of disdain for having got a kitchen fire; she put them right in no uncertain terms as it was my fault that grilling burgers had gone pretty wrong!


Don't you leave us hanging with curiosity FD, did you kill the cat? :?:
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#1783888
eltonioni wrote:Don't you leave us hanging with curiosity FD, did you kill the cat? :?:


Heavens NO!

When the fire was extinguished I went upstairs and the cat was soundly asleep ready to accept more fuss. He carried on living another 12 years, a big move abroad and hunting the locals, until he died age 18 3/4 peacefully in my arms at the vet.

I love our animals to bits but I know they are animals, not humans.
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#1783924
Three weeks ago I stopped at the Red traffic lights in Wick and and ambulance came storming through, lights and sirens blazing. Little did I know at the time that my younger brother was inside with a heart attack. They stabilised him a bit in the local hospital but then sent him 120 miles south to Inverness. An ECG was sent while he was on the way and they tried to turn the ambulance back - no hope. Nevertheless they continued to Inverness as he took another “turn” while half way. They told him on arrival that he had two days and that was it. I went down early next morning to say our final goodbyes. True to form his final words to me was “5h1 t happens”. If we lived further south he could have made it - no golden hour here. He surrendered to his maker next morning.
#1783932
Miscellaneous wrote:
...... Two bigger considerations are;

All these units are unavailable for the duration of the calls.

There is risk to blue light operations, particularly on single track roads.

Whichever way I consider it I cannot conclude it was an appropriate level of response. :naughty: ....
.


To some extent, I understand the logic of your comment but do any of us know exactly how these calls are prioritised? Does anyone 'know' how they would they be treated "if" another call came in where there was a more obvious risk to human life. I certainly don't know the answer, does anyone else?

It is not uncommon for such exercises to be reviewed, after the event, from the point of view of training and maintaining currency of skills which results in 'value' being achieved from responding to the call. As others have mentioned, a professional response is unlikely to lead to a situation where the "rescuers need rescuing", which is an all too often outcome of seemingly less important situations.