[kanga]

..

Unless you have a very, very, very good reason, everyone has to get back to work now.

Um, maybe, although the merits of each 'reason' may be contentious. However, as many employers and individuals have discovered, in our service economy where many well paid people move computer bits around rather than physically fabricating things, it may be possible for such to be just as or more productive and very likely happier doing that from home. If so, investment by pension funds or anyone else in those huge city centre office blocks may have been a bubble waiting to burst anyway ..

[PeteSpencer]

So I'll willingly wear a mask and be first in the queue with my sleeve rolled up when they call for vaccine testing volunteers... (ellipsis for Trent 772)

You can sign up here Peter, I've already done so:
https://www.nhs.uk/sign-up-to-be-contacted-for-research

Done.

Peter

[eltonioni]

However, as many employers and individuals have discovered, in our service economy where many well paid people move computer bits around rather than physically fabricating things, it may be possible for such to be just as or more productive and very likely happier doing that from home.

They need to do that from the office, not home. It's not about an office, it's about the whole supply chain of the UK economy because very soon there won't be any computer bits to move around from home or otherwise.

If so, investment by pension funds or anyone else in those huge city centre office blocks may have been a bubble waiting to burst anyway ..

Best get planting potatoes in the front garden then. Maybe erect some kind of security fence around them too. The guard dogs can probably be fed on the corpses of newly dead telephone sanitisers for a while.

[johnm]

I have been interested to see my son working from home in what is essentially a shut down industry, i.e. classical music.

He has abandoned his London flat for a week or two and is living in the rather more congenial environment of the Cotswolds where he has turned our dining room into an office and is busily phoning, emailing and Zooming with people from all over planet Earth as they try to sort out what is cancelled, what might go ahead and when they might start having bookings on a more normal basis.

He is managing to get work for some of his clients via radio and/or sponsorship, some are choosing to do Facebook and Youtube, basically for practice, to "keep their hand in" so to speak.

It's a very difficult job and he's had a 25% pay cut, but counts himself very lucky compared to some.

He also wears a face covering made by his mum when heading for the shops

[eltonioni]

So he's another one who's not opening his wallet in London.

Very soon there won't be any theatres, venues, cafes, restaurants, hotdog stands and sanitary towel dispensers to go back to.

[johnm]

So he's another one who's not opening his wallet in London.

Very soon there won't be any theatres, venues, cafes, restaurants, hotdog stands and sanitary towel dispensers to go back to.

Theatres and related venues are still firmly shut, though efforts are in train to open them with distanced audiences which has issues about financial viability. He is certainly patronising Cotswold restaurants and street food outlets, mostly at my expense , though none of us would be seen dead near a hotdog stand or a kebab van

He was patronising restaurants in London and many of his resident friends still are and he will be heading back in a couple of weeks after a well earned break.

As long as we keep the risk management going and drive the case rate down we stand a chance of getting things up and running.

It's noticeable in Cirencester, where I was this morning, that quite a few of us but by no means all were wearing face coverings and most shops are now geared for distancing and have screens up at the counters. The next big risk will queue management in bad weather. People are happy queueing outside at present, but........

[eltonioni]

@johnm your lad might be interested in precedent:

[johnm]

@johnm your lad might be interested in precedent:

Thanks, we're all too well aware of the issues

[eltonioni]

Worryingly if you look down that Twitter thread it notes that F&B is about 20% of T/O and 40% of profit, not that there has been anything but losses so far this year. I'm not seeing how they are going to recover unless they have many millions stashed away for a rainy day. Let's hope that compulsory masks encourage people to go out instead of deterring them.

[Bill McCarthy]

I, for one, am happy to report that I have never been to a theatre in my life, and too long in the tooth now to start going - anyway there are none about. I reckon I’ve been to a cinema about three times since teenage years. I ventured out to the local butcher today, mask in top pocket of ovvies for when I enter the shop. I met no one when in the street. Mask on, into shop, the person serving not wearing a mask or was there a screen between us.
However, I can categorically guarantee that anyone wearing a mask will at some point breach containment by touching / adjusting their own mask, then go on to “contaminate” some surface. I’ve had this lesson time and time again after being contaminated by radio active material in the past. There are a huge number of contamination trails that can catch you out.

We had a “tea leaf” on my first ship who was nicking cash from messmates lockers. This happened over many months until someone came up with with the bright idea of setting a trap using bait notes marked with tiny amounts of fluorescent die (used for sea water condenser leak testing). The bait was taken, and the marker traced by ultraviolet light. The trail of dye was really surprising - it was detected all over the place. The thief - discharged with disgrace from the mob in front of the entire ships company.

[johnm]

@Bill McCarthy We know the risk of touching and adjusting, but if someone is infected they will be shedding virus onto surfaces anyway, wearing a face covering will reduce that, but the issue just emphasises the need for handwashing/ sanitising at frequent intervals as well.

[Rob P]

As I have just posted on another thread, masks now compulsory in France in all enclosed spaces.

Observance seems to be 100%

Rob P

[Paul_Sengupta]

Eltonioni, I'm at a loss to understand why you think a resurgence in the virus, which would probably include further months of national lockdown, would be better for the economy than controlling it and keeping it in check and allowing people to resume normality, albeit with a mask on.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53471497

"Other regions are also worrying authorities. Brittany in the north-west of France has a reproduction number of 2.6 - meaning each infected person is passing on the virus to nearly three more. The eastern department of Vosges is also seeing rising cases, while the R number in Marseille and Nice is reportedly at 1.55.

Mr Véran plans to travel to Mayenne later on Monday. While the country is "very far" from a second wave, he told broadcaster France Info that there were "worrying signs of epidemic resumption".

"We must remain vigilant," he said, noting that people had become weary of the restrictions and wanted to return to normal life. "All options are on the table" if local outbreaks worsen, he added, including regional lockdowns or even the return of national restrictions."

[skydriller]

There was an amazing ammount of goodwill and compliance across Europe during the lockdowns. Any civil unrest was not really widely broadcast for obvious reasons.

Any government deciding that a lockdown is required again (as per March-May in France) is looking at being ousted in the longterm and possible/probable civil unrest in the short term, mark my words.

[johnm]

This is where we’ll see those governments that are about public service sacrifice themselves and those who are about holding onto power sacrificing citizens.

All face a substantial number of cretins in their electorate