Non aviation content. Play nice – No religion, no politics and no axe grinding please.

Moderator: Flyin'Dutch'

  • 1
  • 100
  • 101
  • 102
  • 103
  • 104
  • 463
By johnm
#1664802
While the philosophical basis of the two legal codes are rightly described above, the practical situation is not very different these days. Most practical day to day activities are now permitted and codified under Napoleonic model and there's a long and growing list of things forbidden or requiring permission under the common law model.

While the common law model has much to commend it, there are serious weaknesses in fairness across the social spectrum, power and money are still as influential in many areas as they were in 1215. The increasing centralisation we've seen since the Thatcher era does nothing to mitigate this either.
By Leodisflyer
#1664806
johnm wrote:<Snip>The increasing centralisation we've seen since the Thatcher era does nothing to mitigate this either.


The war between Maggie and Ken in the 80s has ongoing impact on our lives in West Yorkshire every day.

West Yorkire had a pretty effective unitary authority and joined up public transport system, but didn't get involved in the ideological battles of the time. It didn't stop West Yorkshire being abolished along with the rest of the Mets. One ongoing consequence is the very high cost of public transport, lack of joined up ticketing that London enjoys and resulting horrendous congestion.

There's been a large shift of power to the bottom right corner of England and the people who work there seem to resent investment that they don't see (withdrawal of funding of the Leeds tram system was one example, there are many more).

When extremes enter into ideological wars it is always the ordinary people, who don't engage in polarised politics and want to get on with their lives, who suffer. Them, their children and grandchildren.

Leeds has been caught in te cross-fire this time round too. It voted to remain, albeit narrowly and reflecting the wider split in the country. When I moved here the place was, seriously run down. It has been transformed into a modern vibrant internationalist city, but the very industries that bring it wealth and high value jobs - financial services and information technology - are ones that stand to lose significantly from a hard Brexit and any form of Brexit the increases problems for `financial Services and free movement of data between the UK and the EU.

On the plus side Brexit will bring a large increase in the public sector and there were already plans to locate more civil service jobs in the centre of Leeds.
kanga, Cowshed, Kittyhawk liked this
By Leodisflyer
#1664821
For fun I've done a quick text search of the Data Protection Act 2018, which mainly consists of the wording of the GDPR:

- The word "freedom" (or "freedoms") appears 43 times
- The word "rights" appears 115 times

Serious question - can anybody point to a piece of legislation originating wholly in the UK Parliament that uses these words to that extent?

To be clear - I've only searched the Act itself, not the detailed guidance that is used to assess risk and determine fines etc. Rights and freedoms are used extensively there too.

The common law thing is starting to make sense now - in an unregulated environment you have to explicitly include rights and freedoms when creating laws so as to not remove them. In an environment that starts with an assumption that you can do nothing, then you create rules that protect and consider people and their rights. If you make your money out of a lack of regulation, or can see ways of exploiting a lack of regulation, then you are not going to be a fan of the regulations that emerge.
kanga, johnm liked this
By Cessna57
#1665171
Jeepers, looks like we could be leaving without a deal.

So we just revert to trading with the EU the same way that Syria / Africa does I presume?

Here’s an unforeseen outcome, they’re not going to be coming across the channel on small boats shortly, everyone will be going the other way on small boats to get to a country that has food and healthcare.
User avatar
By nallen
#1665175
Cessna57 wrote:Here’s an unforeseen outcome, they’re not going to be coming across the channel on small boats shortly, everyone will be going the other way on small boats to get to a country that has food and healthcare.


Those relishing irony will be routing via Dunkirk.
kanga, johnm liked this
By Mike Tango
#1665176
In a speech in Stoke today Theresa May will cite the Welsh devolution referendum, how despite a very narrow margin in favour "That result was accepted by both sides and the popular legitimacy of that institution has never seriously been questioned."

She will fail to mention that after the referendum result in favour she voted against the establishment of the Welsh Assembly and subsequently stood on a manifesto pledge that offered to abolish it.

Her recent claims to be guided by her faith doesn’t seem to include steering her away from lies and hypocrisy.
By malcolmfrost
#1665178
Apparently Mumsnet users think there will be a shortage of bananas with no deal. Have I missed the thousands of acres of banana plantations in Poland?
User avatar
By eltonioni
#1665185
Cessna57 wrote:Jeepers, looks like we could be leaving without a deal.

So we just revert to trading with the EU the same way that Syria / Africa does I presume?


We revert to trading with the EU the same way that we do now with the USA, China, India, Australia, NZ, Brazil, Argentina, Russia, etc. Quite a few of them have indicated that early trade deals are important to them. Then there are the countries that have some kind of light touch EU deal like Norway, Pakistan, India who seem willing to roll over current arrangements with the UK.

Obviously because the EU makes it illegal (gotcha) to do deals while still in the EU it will take a bit of time, hence the transition, but even with No Deal in March my hunch is that some kind of initial UK/EU arrangement will happen this year if only because German industry and French banks will force it. No backstop required.

For reference, this is the pure WTO rules trade the EU / UK has ATM. The EU does not have trade deals with all the rest:

Image
User avatar
By Flyin'Dutch'
#1665189
eltonioni wrote:Obviously because the EU makes it illegal (gotcha) to do deals while still in the EU it will take a bit of time, hence the transition, but even with No Deal in March my hunch is that some kind of initial UK/EU arrangement will happen this year if only because German industry and French banks will force it. No backstop required.


The backstop is required should there be a tariff gradient over the border.

WTO rules without a further deal = tariff gradient.
User avatar
By kanga
#1665194
Pete L wrote:Iceland - which isn't in the EU :-)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banana_production_in_Iceland


There is a microclimate in one small valley in Southern Crete, where they have long grown bananas of a variety neither commonly used nor marketed outside the island. It was the accession of Greece that required EU regulators for the first time to define the EU-wide classification of banana Classes (to be used on shipping boxes etc). It was heavy lobbying only by UK wholesalers (looking for shipping and stacking efficiency) which led to the definition of Class 1 Cavendish variety (the only sort usually seen in UK supermarkets) including minimum size and (to bemusement of other nations' industries' representatives. who had no pertinent concerns) curvature. It was this detail in the resultant regulations which led to a certain Brussels-based UK journalist with an anti-EU brief from his editor to generate UK tabloid headlines on the lines of 'barmy Brussels bureaucrats ban bendy bananas'. This is a fair reflection of UK media reporting of EU matters through the decades. :roll:

[the journalist went on to a career in UK politics including senior Ministerial office, but has now returned to journalism on the back benches]
Flyin'Dutch', nallen, johnm and 2 others liked this
User avatar
By Flyin'Dutch'
#1665197
eltonioni wrote:Neither HMRC or Revenue Commissioners require the backstop, or a hard border. Both have made No Deal plans.


I might be a bit slow on the uptake here but can you explain why the the control of the UK borders needed to be taken back?
User avatar
By eltonioni
#1665199
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:
eltonioni wrote:Neither HMRC or Revenue Commissioners require the backstop, or a hard border. Both have made No Deal plans.


I might be a bit slow on the uptake here but can you explain why the the control of the UK borders needed to be taken back?

You're not slow ;) Something about immigration innit.
  • 1
  • 100
  • 101
  • 102
  • 103
  • 104
  • 463