For help, advice and discussion about stuff not related to aviation. Play nice: no religion, no politics and no axe grinding please.
  • 1
  • 4
  • 5
  • 6
  • 7
  • 8
  • 118
#1610935
karlbown wrote:Not really sure what I can say about this. If you don’t think it’s greener to get solar or wind generated electricity to a socket than get petrol to a supermarket then I think you’re missing something.

I think you may be missing something if you think green energy is all about motoring. :D

As I say; I'd like to see some true calculations about how green the energy produced from a wind farm is and not just those designed to impress.

There's quite a bit of oil used in the production, transporting and installation of wind farms before they generate anything to send anywhere.

You any idea how much concrete goes in to some of these bases to support a tower, or how environmentally damaging producing cement is? :wink:

My point is that the so called green energy is not as green as one may be led to believe.

Anyway we digress, I have yet to drive an electric vehicle (I won't embarrass myself by telling you of my only hybrid experience :oops: ), however I have yet to hear anyone say it is not a rewarding experience. For that reason I have absolutely no doubt they will continue to grow in popularity. In my opinion that should be the reason for buying one, the bigger picture and longer term implications I simply cannot see being realised as many anticipate.

I look forward to the time it makes sense for me to have one, likely to be a while though. :(
MikeB, skydriller liked this
#1610936
Not missing anything as far as I know. How much environmental impact is there in building an oil rig? Or a nuclear power station?

The amount of wind farms to generate the same energy as a nuclear power station actually use less cement. They last as long and don't have the cleanup required afterwards. And wind farms are getting so much more efficient. Just follow the progress made over the last few years in design.

I look forward to more efficient, hidden (underwater?) renewables with low impact and cheap energy.

It's gonna happen, just the timescale I think.

Whether an EV works for you depends on your driving mix at the moment. The longer we go on the more people will find themselves finding an EV cheaper and more convenient than an ICE. And money is the big motivator. If the government said everyone has to have EV and they're more expensive then that just wouldn't work. Like I said before market forces are driving the energy markets. It'll happen whether we want it to or not!

I've had an electric or phev for 5 years. Had less problems with my Leaf than any other car I've ever owned, probably cause it's more akin to a vacuum cleaner in technology :-)

My A3 etron I used in mixed driving (we only had one car at the time) and got a high of 392 mpg for a fill up.

Miscellaneous wrote:
karlbown wrote:Not really sure what I can say about this. If you don’t think it’s greener to get solar or wind generated electricity to a socket than get petrol to a supermarket then I think you’re missing something.

I think you may be missing something if you think green energy is all about motoring. :D

As I say; I'd like to see some true calculations about how green the energy produced from a wind farm is and not just those designed to impress.

There's quite a bit of oil used in the production, transporting and installation of wind farms before they generate anything to send anywhere.

You any idea how much concrete goes in to some of these bases to support a tower, or how environmentally damaging producing cement is? :wink:

My point is that the so called green energy is not as green as one may be led to believe.

Anyway we digress, I have yet to drive an electric vehicle (I won't embarrass myself by telling you of my only hybrid experience :oops: ), however I have yet to hear anyone say it is not a rewarding experience. For that reason I have absolutely no doubt they will continue to grow in popularity. In my opinion that should be the reason for buying one, the bigger picture and longer term implications I simply cannot see being realised as many anticipate.

I look forward to the time it makes sense for me to have one, likely to be a while though. :(
User avatar
By Rob P
#1610938
Surely the main "greeness" factor these days is the reduction in harmful urban pollution? Power stations and concrete plants tend not to be in town centres.

But the basic point that Misc makes I support - you buy an EV for the better driving experience, the rest is fairly incidental.

Rob P
#1610943
Have you seen how much concrete is required for wind turbines ? Mine is just 6kw but the footings required 6 cubic meters. You ought to see how much is needed for them in moorland.
Tidal flow (12knots) turbines are being placed right now in the Pentland Firth and is dependable, but the seal huggers complaineth loudly about it.
My turbine returns £900 per quarter (along with very low 'leccy and central heating oil bills) which leads me even, to consider EV.
#1610947
Miscellaneous wrote:As I say; I'd like to see some true calculations about how green the energy produced from a wind farm is and not just those designed to impress.

See p37 of https://www.climatexchange.org.uk/media ... _power.pdf
As a starting point.
This is a research paper, going through the large number of studies on this topic - looking at financial and environmental full lifecycle costs of wind - in this case, specifically offshore wind (which has higher costs than onshore).
karlbown liked this
#1610952
Of course all this is really important when it starts to bring the costs of aviation down! Imagine going up for an hours bimble for a £1 (or free if you have solar) with greatly reduced maintenance costs (well we can wish).

Plus reduced noise will makes us less unpopular with those people that didn’t realise that big grass thing they just bought a house next to is an airfield.

Plus lower costs for training aircraft might mean instructors can be paid more.

Now that’s much more important than cars!
Flyin'Dutch' liked this
#1610971
malcolmfrost wrote:To be fair, so are petrol stations (or mini marts as they are now)! Last night from Denham to Hindhead there was only one station open at 10pm so it was orange light from Guildford!


There are at least two 24h petrol stations in Guildford. And a few more close at 11pm or midnight. The Shell on the A25 "Guildford bypass" would be convenient for you. Just come off at the Guildford turnoff, turn onto the A25 which runs parallel to the A3, get petrol, then get back on the A3 at the roundabout by my office. Think of it as a pit lane! ;-)

Then there are the ones on the A3 between the M25 and Guildford.

karlbown wrote:I've had an electric or phev for 5 years. Had less problems with my Leaf than any other car I've ever owned, probably cause it's more akin to a vacuum cleaner in technology :-)


Hmm, the motor's just recently burnt out in my Dyson. :?
Last edited by Paul_Sengupta on Thu May 10, 2018 12:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
#1610973
karlbown wrote:
Miscellaneous wrote:Oh, and charging points are still rather thin on the ground!


Not sure what you mean by this? My house has dozens of charging points in it already, as does almost every home in the UK. No real shortage is there?


All very well with your own private garden & driveway - Try that in most towns & cities where the streets are lined with parked cars, often parked quite some way from the owners residence. And thats just the UK we are presumably talking about.

I think "we" will be using ICE for a while yet. My lifetime anyway, regardless of government targets.

Regards, SD..
#1610975
They don't make the DB9 any more sorry. Otherwise of course. Can you imagine if someone did get all the ICE cars? What would the VED be like?

Paul_Sengupta wrote:
karlbown wrote:I tell you what Steve, you can have all the ice cars over the next few years. How’s that?


If this is happening, can someone drop round a new Aston Martin DB9 to my place please?

Thanks.
#1610978
karlbown wrote:They don't make the DB9 any more sorry. Otherwise of course. Can you imagine if someone did get all the ICE cars? What would the VED be like?


Dammit. Ok, maybe a nice second hand one then! ;-)

You'd need a few old airfields to store that lot on too...
karlbown liked this
#1610980
I hesitate to ask where you were putting it.

Our electric tumble dryer is coming up for 30 years now. Fridge not much less. Not seen any need to replace them yet, or any maintenance required. Electrical stuff generally has less moving parts than mechanical stuff so tends to last longer. Can you imagine a petrol vacuum cleaner? I imagine mowers run at at lot lower revs so it helps their reliability but most people have electric nowadays I would think. (that's my wife's department)

Paul_Sengupta wrote:
karlbown wrote:I've had an electric or phev for 5 years. Had less problems with my Leaf than any other car I've ever owned, probably cause it's more akin to a vacuum cleaner in technology :-)


Hmm, the motor's just recently burnt out in my Dyson. :?
#1610990
If you buy a Dyson you are the author of your own misfortune.

This does touch on the threatening demise of the Service Department as a profit centre for car dealerships. There's so little to do on EV and nothing much beyond tyres in the way of consumables that this major source of income is likely to dry up almost totally

Rob P
Flyin'Dutch' liked this
#1610996
There are at least two 24h petrol stations in Guildford. And a few more close at 11pm or midnight. The Shell on the A25 "Guildford bypass" would be convenient for you. Just come off at the Guildford turnoff, turn onto the A25 which runs parallel to the A3, get petrol, then get back on the A3 at the roundabout by my office. Think of it as a pit lane! ;-)

Then there are the ones on the A3 between the M25 and Guildford.

But with an EV I wouldn't have had to stop at all as it would have been fully charged before I left home!!
  • 1
  • 4
  • 5
  • 6
  • 7
  • 8
  • 118