For help, advice and discussion about stuff not related to aviation. Play nice: no religion, no politics and no axe grinding please.
#1589653
The winter fuel allowance, Christmas bonus, free bus pass, ‘senior discount’ on cinema tickets (all of which I get) should be taxed. Low income baby boomers would be unaffected, the rest of us won’t notice.
By johnm
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#1589655
We might not notice it in the financial sense, but how many of us would vote for it?? Therein lies the rub.....
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By johnm
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#1589656
So we should stop spending money overseas and spend it here, perhaps on social care.

If only it were that simple :roll:
#1589663
How often have I said it - the "children" of the elderly ought to take care of their parents rather than lumber the state and overloading the NHS with them !! I guess it was Labour who handed out the freebies - fuel allowance, bus passes etc. etc to win a few more votes at an election - but imaging the bleating if they were taken away
#1589664
johnm wrote:
So we should stop spending money overseas and spend it here, perhaps on social care.

If only it were that simple :roll:

In 2015 the UK spent just over £12bn on foreign aid. Looking down the list of countries I notice that India received about £175m, why when they can spend money on a space program and are ranked as 7th in the world for wealth.
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#1589669
By overseas I meant buying goods and paying dividends for our assets like railways. Aid is a different issue and wealthy countries like the UK should play their part (though perhaps not keep giving to countries with nuclear weapons and a space programme)
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By Flyin'Dutch'
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#1589674
Bill McCarthy wrote:How often have I said it - the "children" of the elderly ought to take care of their parents rather than lumber the state and overloading the NHS with them !!


So what about the people who don't have children?

Or the children of parents who abused their kids?

One could argue that those who have children have already ensured that those children are contributing to the upkeep of the state and society, so why should these groups of people be penalised by having to carry the burden of caring for the elderly whilst those families who don't contribute to society in that way get off scot free?

The cost of children to the NHS is small fry.

Apart from the first 5 years, which is mainly GP appointments and vaccinations, there really is not much input by the NHS in the way of healthcare demand.
By johnm
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#1589680
Yet another issue with no simple answers, which is why we need better people in government.

I'm fed up with hearing the ever growing list of public sector issues, with one standard and fatuous response from HMG, a number with £ sign in front of it. :roll:
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#1589682
A major part of the problem is the fundamental issue of simply accepting that as we age we will require care. Prevention of conditions is a far better option than waiting until people require expensive care, yet in this country we don't seem to value that at all. Public Health moved from the NHS into local authorities in 2013 and the opportunities were immense (I have to declare an interest here as a specialist!) . However we have seen our budgets consistently cut despite good evidence showing that effective public health measures can show 10s of pounds saving for each pound spent. We are having great success at the moment with utilizing council services to promote health yet face diminishing budgets. Not sensible and not effective. If I could get a quarter of my population to walk a mile a day the health impact and increase in healthy life expectancy is huge. But as a nation we don't want to pay.....
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By rikur_
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#1589685
romille wrote:
johnm wrote: which is why we need better people in government

Better people can earn much more money making profits for the shareholders of large corporations.

For me, money's not the barrier - but the intrusion, confrontation and sound-bite ridicule.
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By Flyin'Dutch'
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#1589686
Misha_the_Penguin wrote: But as a nation we don't want to pay.....


Part of the problem is that some PH work is difficult to understand by the general population.

Another part is that PH has not been particularly good at selling its successes to the general public.

And finally PH is not particularly sexy and some of its messages are positively dull.

A shiny new scanner appeal more to the general population than 'walk a mile a day and you will healthier for longer'

The sad reality is that more people will benefit more from the walking a mile a day than any new scanner.

But people will always see themselves as individuals rather than accepting that they are but one in a large group of people.

Reduction in smoking rates, teenage pregnancies, reduction in risky behaviours by young folks (including smoking, drinking, unsafe sex and using drugs) are a couple of the examples where careful intervention and nudging better behaviours have been instrumental.

You can no doubt extend the list.
#1589692
Mrs _W procures Adult Social Care services for one of the larger county councils. She says one of the biggest rising elements of the cost is the number of handicapped children surviving to adulthood who, fifty years ago, would have died before attaining school age.
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By Flyin'Dutch'
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#1589693
matthew_w100 wrote:Mrs _W procures Adult Social Care services for one of the larger county councils. She says one of the biggest rising elements of the cost is the number of handicapped children surviving to adulthood who, fifty years ago, would have died before attaining school age.



Your wife will no doubt have the figures to hand but it would be my guess that in absolute numbers the oldies top the total cost by a fair margin.

Maybe you can ask her?

Edited to add:

Indeed. Here is the NAO report.

https://www.nao.org.uk/wp-content/uploa ... erview.pdf
By johnm
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#1589694
As we have said there are no easy answers but there's a moral and costly dilemma for medics and society as a whole which is about preserving life irrespective of quality.

I may have quoted this before and I don't where it comes from:

"Thou shalt not kill but need not strive officiously to keep alive".

As I said at the beginning I see many pictures on TV of old folk who can do nothing but sit and dribble and pop the pills that are keeping them going, no thanks.