[romille]

.. I can only imagine that fraud is rife as it seems to be in most government run organisations. ..

any evidence that it is (in either case) ?

Seems to me that there are numerous cases of people receiving benefits by making fraudulent claims and the tax and VAT are regularly defrauded of huge sums. I know some cases end up in court but they are the few.

[JAFO]

Hey, romille, I bet you're glad you asked the question about filters in fags now, eh?

[romille]

Hey, romille, I bet you're glad you asked the question about filters in fags now, eh?

Exactly, talk about being waylaid

[defcribed]

I suspect that prescribing nicotine patches in the long run is more beneficial to the UK PLC* than putting a copper in every NHS outlet.

*reduced health care cost and increased and longer tax take by being more healthy for longer.

It's not that clear cut. The coffers of UK PLC benefit enormously from the fact that smokers die younger and therefore in many cases don't draw much in the way of state pension before kicking the bucket.

The fundamental pension sums (for healthy people) just don't add up anymore. Work for 45 years and draw pension for a further 10 was a sustainable financial balance. Work for 45 and draw pension for 25 is not.

[Flyin'Dutch']

d,

The notion that smokers 'pay their way' has long been refuted.

Quite apart from the fact that smoking related illnesses cause a host of miserable chronic diseases.

So alone to alleviate that suffering we should do all we can to help people not to smoke.

And smoking is no more a 'free choice' than any other addiction.

[defcribed]

d,

The notion that smokers 'pay their way' has long been refuted.

Quite apart from the fact that smoking related illnesses cause a host of miserable chronic diseases.

So alone to alleviate that suffering we should do all we can to help people not to smoke.

And smoking is no more a 'free choice' than any other addiction.

I didn't say they paid their way and I didn't say we shouldn't encourage people not to smoke.

I said that if they live longer as a result of not smoking then there are extra costs. Healthcare is not the only cost associated with increased longevity.

I disagree on the free choice I'm afraid. No-one puts a gun to anyone's head and forces them to light up. You can always elect not to do it. It may take willpower and moral fibre, and I know that's not fashionable these days...

[Flyin'Dutch']

I disagree on the free choice I'm afraid. No-one puts a gun to anyone's head and forces them to light up. You can always elect not to do it. It may take willpower and moral fibre, and I know that's not fashionable these days...

Starting smoking - totally agree.

The addicted - not so. They need help and our sympathy.

PS.: I am a never smoked guy and my only addiction is flying!

[defcribed]

We might have to agree to disagree on that last part. Physical withdrawal from nicotine is actually very quick (compared to opiates and the like). It's the habit that is the problem, and people can always control that given sufficient willpower.

[PaulB]

We've touched on Health Tourism a couple of times. Full Fact have investigated this. The bottom line is

It’s difficult to put a figure on exactly how much “health tourism” costs the NHS. 0.3% reflects the upper end of the government’s rough estimates of “deliberate health tourism” and visitors “taking advantage” of the system.

[chevvron]

d,

The notion that smokers 'pay their way' has long been refuted.

Quite apart from the fact that smoking related illnesses cause a host of miserable chronic diseases.

So alone to alleviate that suffering we should do all we can to help people not to smoke.

And smoking is no more a 'free choice' than any other addiction.

Latest I heard was e-cigarette 'smokers' are more likely to get pnuemonia.

[Jim Jones]

Reference?

[kanga]

..
..
Latest I heard was e-cigarette 'smokers' are more likely to get pnuemonia.

(And dyslexia ? )

More than whom ? 'flame' smokers or the general populace ?