For help, advice and discussion about stuff not related to aviation. Play nice: no religion, no politics and no axe grinding please.
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#1895471
flybymike wrote:Many, perhaps most, people won’t have the faintest idea whether they’ve been infected in the previous six months, let alone produce proof.


Possibly true.
But we're talking health workers who are presumably regularly tested, right?
And didnt the UK hand out free tests like sweeties at one point?
(But not to be used for travel, naturally there are extortionate fees for that..)

Or do I mis-remember...(definitely not the travel test rip-off though)

Regards, SD..
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#1895481
Once we stop incessantly testing there will be no “proof” of recent infection so vaccination will be the only possible defence against restriction. This focus on covid-19 will haveto be relaxed at some point or the world will disappear up it’s own behind. We already have many institutions ignoring government guidelines to keep much stricter measures to CYA, presumably. I am not confident that humanity will ever regain perspective.
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By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895488
Flyingfemme wrote: I am not confident that humanity will ever regain perspective.


Humanity never had perspective, nor does 'the public' whoever they may be.

Driven by the media, and their various promoters, backers, owners the focus shifts, with an upset here, an outrage there.

Most people, out of necessity, have to concentrate on the everyday struggle to stay alive and provide for themselves and their nearest and dearest.

The better off stuff a tenner in a doo-good fund on occasion.

Every now and then there is a cataclysm which shifts society as a whole. But soon it's all back in the old rut.

Will happen with this too. In fact a lot of things are already back to how they were before.
#1895489
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:... a lot of things are already back to how they were before.


Hallelujah! :thumleft:

It will be interesting to see how very many nations unwind their newly found fascist streak; France and Germany not being the least of them. Perhaps they will just drop them overnight on the pretext of "We won the War" and hope that nobody notices just how misguided and evil they had become.
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By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895493
eltonioni wrote:It will be interesting to see how very many nations unwind their newly found fascist streak; France and Germany not being the least of them. Perhaps they will just drop them overnight on the pretext of "We won the War" and hope that nobody notices just how misguided and evil they had become.


My father died last year - great age of 92., after a full life lived well. I'd also contend he was a wise man - but then I am biased.

His observation was that most name calling was people regurgitating their own affliction.

Nobody around here world beating.
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#1895503
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:
eltonioni wrote:It will be interesting to see how very many nations unwind their newly found fascist streak; France and Germany not being the least of them. Perhaps they will just drop them overnight on the pretext of "We won the War" and hope that nobody notices just how misguided and evil they had become.


My father died last year - great age of 92., after a full life lived well. I'd also contend he was a wise man - but then I am biased.

His observation was that most name calling was people regurgitating their own affliction.

Nobody around here world beating.


Just to be clear FD, are you saying that I am a fascist because I observe fascist actions in others?
#1895532
Flyingfemme wrote:Once we stop incessantly testing there will be no “proof” of recent infection so vaccination will be the only possible defence against restriction.


Actually, that's what I was alluding to in my previous post.

Incessantly testing for a current infection - as in jaggy q-tip up the noz - could probably be drastically reduced.

Testing antibody levels - whether those derived from a natural infection and/or from vaccine (cf the N or S in the link posted previously) - seems like a no-brainer to me, with very few drawbacks as far as I currently understand.

If it really is just 25 euro/quid a pop (I heard 13 euro in DE), then shirley those not wanting/unable to have vaccine + booster etc - should regularly have their antibody levels tested?

If below x level then: either
1. Get vaccinated/boosted
2. Accept "local restrictions apply"

I'm sure it's not as simple as that - that multiple key indicators such as age, general health would have to be factored in - but if "immunity" is the way out of this, then why aren't we doing more widespread testing?

Clearly, quality peer reviewed studies have been done - and the results of those can be extrapolated onto the wider population - but such studies will already be out of date in terms of variants etc long before they've reached a Journal.

We know from decades of good studies that various biomarkers indicate the increased probability of x health issue - take blood sugar levels as a really simple example - it's one of the basics on a standard health check.

Or, keeping more in line with my train(wreck?) of thought - cytomegalovirus. Maybe not in the UK (unless it's changed?), but in many countries, there are standard antibody checks done during pregnancy - IgG and IgM levels.

One test checks "Does Mum currently have, or (more likely) have had CMV in the past" and the other can help determine if it's a recent infection.

If latter, then Mum gets tested frequently to determine which way the antibodies are going, as when the infection happens during certain periods of the pregnancy, it can have serious consequences for the child.

Doesn't it make sense we all (or at least those where it makes most sense) get our "levels checked" WRT Covid antibodies at suitably regular intervals?

Maybe I'm too much of a geek with a strong data analytics background - but isn't having an ever-growing and current/fresh dataset better than extrapolating from fast decaying and population limited studies? :scratch:
Last edited by OCB on Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
#1895560
eltonioni wrote:
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:... a lot of things are already back to how they were before.


Hallelujah! :thumleft:

It will be interesting to see how very many nations unwind their newly found fascist streak; France and Germany not being the least of them. Perhaps they will just drop them overnight on the pretext of "We won the War" and hope that nobody notices just how misguided and evil they had become.



Did you deliberately not include the Uk in there to provoke a reaction ?
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By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1895562
@eltonioni

No.

What interests me is why there is a narrative, as echoed by your post, that in Germany and France there are 'fascist streaks'

Now I only know too well that looking at something from a bit of a distance brings a new perspective, sometimes difficult to see from nearby but I fail to see any emergence of fascism amongst governments here.

What are your observations that make you write this?

Or are you referring to the right-wing covid denying nutters of which seemingly few countries are spared?
#1895575
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:What interests me is why there is a narrative, as echoed by your post, that in Germany and France there are 'fascist streaks'


My grandad would have been 109 this year and he was an man of impeccably good manners and an exquisite observer of human nature due to standing behind his newsagent's counter for sixty years. Aside from his good judgement that I did and still do have "grand leggies", he observed that the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. Continental Europe has always been bedevilled with autocrats who wish themselves to be dictators. Some of them get the chance but they all overreach, such is the ultimate nature of fascism.

I give you the definition d'jour from Wikipedia: Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and the economy



@Keveng do I really need to say more about how I think the UK has handled Covid? :)
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