Discuss the problems and solutions to all of the situations that Pilot X finds himself in.
#1659619
Some good comments! Just some food for thought, how many of you would have gone around with 500meters of available tarmac runway and doing 80knots at 20ft? If you over-run you risk running into the wet grass at the airfield and turning over. That's why I elected to go-around besides it was floating and would keep floating - it's a DA40!!

I think at my speed, I was chewing up 41 meters per second (80 knots = 92mph) So by the time I elected to go-around 350-400meters of runway was available.

GolfHotel wrote:Obviously my post above casts no question of the competence or otherwise of the OP. :twisted:


GolfHotel wrote:
cotterpot wrote:
Any runway with an IAP will be long enough for a GA SEP to land on with approach flap.


Or no flaps


Are you two making an assumption that the pilot is competent? That could be a factor worth considering. :D


I am competent. I love a personal dig! Nobody is infallible, so mistakes do happen. It's how we can learn from them! Hence why I posted it online because I share my flying experiences and adventures safely. :mrgreen:
#1659620
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:
ConcordeBA wrote:During the IMC training, I was taught that at decision height you'd change to landing flap. When I learned to fly in the DA40; nothing was different other than my experience of IFR flying grew as I ventured with a better equipped aircraft.

I was always curious as to why airliners are configured at 1000ft as per company SOP but in GA, it was acceptable to configure in the most critical part of the approach (usually the last 200ft).


It isn't.

Any runway with an IAP will be long enough for a GA SEP to land on with approach flap.


I've never seen anywhere that states you cannot enable landing flap at 200ft. I guess it's just not wise, and for me it feels uncomfortable. In fact how do all the MEP/SEP -IR pilots do it? How does the IR examiner like it?
#1659628
ConcordeBA wrote:Some good comments!


.....

I am competent. I love a personal dig! Nobody is infallible, so mistakes do happen. It's how we can learn from them! Hence why I posted it online because I share my flying experiences and adventures safely. :mrgreen:


You seem determined to tell everyone about your errors for some reason.

No one claims to be infallible. But by heck you do seem to bang on and on about one mistake after another. On every site you can find as well. :shock:
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By c750X
#1660033
GolfHotel wrote:
BUT what do you do when you forget to put the flaps down in the first place? Can you still do a go around?


Yes. What you don't want to do is massive changes - so if extended don't dump it all in one go, likewise don't bang all of it down in one go. When doing flapless approaches in the DA40 I was taught to add first stage once climbing keeping a close eye on speed and attitudes. But if you have the speed you can still climbout quite happily just not at Vx. Late touchdown and no flap, personally I'd probably get on the brakes instead.

As for the go around, Power up-Pitch up-Drag flap up has always worked for me. If in doubt it's worthwhile going somewhere up high and refreshing slow flight techniques with an instructor.
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By GolfHotel
#1660176
c750X wrote:
GolfHotel wrote:
BUT what do you do when you forget to put the flaps down in the first place? Can you still do a go around?


Yes. What you don't want to do is massive changes - so if extended don't dump it all in one go, likewise don't bang all of it down in one go. When doing flapless approaches in the DA40 I was taught to add first stage once climbing keeping a close eye on speed and attitudes. But if you have the speed you can still climbout quite happily just not at Vx. Late touchdown and no flap, personally I'd probably get on the brakes instead.

As for the go around, Power up-Pitch up-Drag flap up has always worked for me. If in doubt it's worthwhile going somewhere up high and refreshing slow flight techniques with an instructor.


Sorry c750X I didn't expect anyone to take that comment seriously. Obviously I need some more :D :D :D or something. I was thinking more of

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By defcribed
#1660255
To the OP:

From your posts and videos, I think you tend to focus on and over-think particular points coming out of certain events. Those points I think are a distraction (or alternative focus?) from the fact that you've run out of experience/competence and scared yourself a bit.

For instance, if you fly an instrument approach and end up at 20ft doing 80kts with only 500m of runway left then it's not a flaps issue - you've just made a complete horlicks of that approach. If you were ahead of the aeroplane you'd have got it into the right place at the right speed even without the flaps.

There is such a thing as over-sharing, and I think you might be close to that line.
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By JAFO
#1660298
Cessna57 wrote:The Cessna’s I’ve flown certainly don’t climb at all at full flap.

I’ve not even tried it in our PA28, maybe I should check what happens.


From experience - and we all know where experience comes from - a PA28 will climb at full flap but it won't climb much and it won't climb well. Houses can start to get very big if you forget to retract (drag) flaps.
By NDB_hold
#1660413
I was taught (PA38) full power, arrest descent, drag flap away, climb attitude. I guess this was to ensure you didn’t lose any more speed (arresting the descent rather than climbing should lead to acceleration even with full flap) and avoid trying to climb at full flap with a rather underpowered aircraft. Also, the runway was shortish (800 in those days at Welshpool) so we would be nailed on the full flap approach speed, so no spare speed to help with the initial climb,
By BehyBill
#1660835
On most instruments runways where they land A320s, I personally prefer to clock 120kts on PA28/DA40 and land flapless, especially when they have procedures are designed with 14DME arcs, 20DME base legs and 7DME fafs

While in the soup I find that I am better being fast and quick for many reasons: few things can go around, small movements and less time to worry about stuff apart from slowing down once getting visual references :lol:

Why? just for the fun of it....

Are you talking about go-around in IMC: full power, full flaps and trim completely off? actually the only way for me to survive that go-around on aircraft I flew is by pushing hard as much as I can on the stick to prevent what looks like a loop on AI/ALT/VSI :lol:
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By A le Ron
#1660841
I was taught
Power up
Pitch up
Gear up
Flaps up
Attitude
Altitude
Airspeed

In that order. Recite it as you do it. After flying the approach with no or half flaps (to keep speed up).
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By A le Ron
#1660862
GolfHotel wrote:
Paul_Sengupta wrote:Is it just me that pitches to an airspeed then? :shifty:


No

In my aircraft I’m usually trimmed for an airspeed during the approach. This is often Vyse or just above. On the go around, the aircraft therefore maintains this speed until the configuration is changed, after which, when clean, a full power climb settles at 120kt. The slight exception is if it is an asymmetric go around, then I’m working quite hard and consciously pitch for blue line to maintain the climb, as small speed differences count.