Learning to fly, or thinking of learning? Post your questions, comments and experiences here

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By Milty
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1899224
Not sure if the CAA are regularly on the Flyer Forum but worth considering that there is some blurb on the pages before doing the e-exams about not copying and reproducing the questions. I don’t recall the exact wording or consequences (and I didn’t write it down), but they’re clearly not keen on the exact questions being reproduced outside of the test room.
By IWF
#1899247
While I can quite understand the CAA reticence in not having exam questions posted and debated, I find their feedback to be unhelpful at best.

I failed my Nav exam at the weekend, but in relation to a couple of questions don't know why. All i'm informed is that I failed a question on Compass Deviation. As I posted yesterday, I think the question was posed in quite a tricky fashion, and even though I wrote it down don't understand what the correct answer is or why my answer was wrong.

I use easy ppl for my training materials. At least with them they explain the correct answer and it came about.

The CAA attitude I think is unhelpful in this regards
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By TrickyWoo
#1899252
I also think the feedback on incorrect questions is unhelpful at best and potentially misleading. 'Read section xyz.4' Right. Cheers for that. Still none the wiser on 3 questions from Operations.

Having taken both old and new Air Law the difference is startling:

Old Air Law. 2012. Shoreham. Go into room. Find piece of paper with multiple choice questions and some answers marked already (incorrectly in one case). 5 mins later job done.

New Air Law. Unknown question bank size (i.e. more than 20!) Pictures, scenarios, head scratching etc. At least the CAA portal instantly uploads the results.

I think (but I can't be sure) therefore that the new exams are significantly more difficult than the old.

Wonder what the more experienced pilots think?
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By T6Harvard
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1899256
I have got one question wrong in 2 exams. The feedback just gives which section of learning objectives I need to brush up on. But here's the thing.....in each case there was only one Q that fell into the stated LO and they were straightforward questions, very basic, and I knew the answer.

I checked with my instructor later, just in case.

I passed but it concerns me

Now I know the marks are automated and don't think the exam is marking things wrong.....
.
Maybe I hurried the answer or indeed misplaced the click but I did double check because there was plenty of time.

Is it possible that the Q -LO reference is incorrect? In which case I got an answer wrong (which I accept is perfectly possible!) but I don't know which.

I know I've put my head above the parapet.....but it is bugging me.
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By TopCat
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1899261
TrickyWoo wrote:I think (but I can't be sure) therefore that the new exams are significantly more difficult than the old.

Wonder what the more experienced pilots think?

This might be quite hard to evaluate, as not many of the people that took the old ones will also have taken the new ones.

I found the old ones fairly straightforward in 1992, without any pre-marked answers!

Recently I signed up for a trial at Easy PPL, and after a bit of revision (I'd forgotten quite a few of the details that aren't relevant to my flying these days), tried out their Air Law practice exams. It was very simple and quick, of course, being online, but the questions didn't strike me as much more difficult than the ones from 30 years ago.

Just one data point, and possibly not a very good one, but that's all I have!
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By AndyR
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1899273
The exams aren’t great for clarity but there are rules about not copying/reproducing etc.

Your instructor should be able to assist in guiding you in the right direction on any of your wrong answers, plus of course a general question online here is not an issue.

I had a student sit the IR(R)/IMC paper the other day which is hopelessly out of date and some questions are frankly just incorrect, but sadly it is what we have to work with. One example would be questions based on the quadrantal rule… :?: :!:
By archerflyer
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1899276
I did the multiple choice around 10 years (then a long break and back at it again). First time round I completed all exams except Nav & this time I've completed all exams.

I found the exams 10 years ago much easier to pass & the questions less complex (this could also be the help of the confuser test books)

This time round I felt I really knew the subjects and alot more confident when the question style was more complex than it had to be.

My big takeaway is that I feel to pass the exams, you really need to understand the subject & not simply pass a known question bank. I think this is a huge positive, but I do agree that the feedback on the papers could be improved. It was a struggle after passing some exams to accurately recall the question and possible answers, to ensure I didn't have any gaps in my knowledge. I think identifying the incorrect questions and correct answers with an explanation would be better.
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By Milty
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1899284
I can't disagree with much of what has been written above so far. Difficult to comment on whether it's harder as I never took the old exams but given the breadth of possible questions, I'd say you definitely have to have a deeper understanding now than before across the full topic range.

I think the principle of what the CAA does in giving guidance on what areas you need to review is good. I don't think that you should be told what question you specifically got wrong and what the correct answer is. It helps with getting exam questions right it doesn't necessarily help you understand the topic better so personally, I think the balance is right. However, I too am pretty sure that something is not right in the feedback given. On my recent comms exam, the feedback pointed me towards radio check procedures. I did not have a question about radio checks in the exam and from recollection (which admittedly could be flawed), I couldn't link any of the questions to the topic of radio checks.

I pondered whether to raise this with the CAA exams team. I decided not to put my head above the parapet and I suspect it would be futile. It took ages to get one exam setup and also to get the results from another on a previous occasion - the school called the CAA for assistance and were told quite seriously that 'it does this on a Friday sometimes, just leave it a while and try again later or take exams on another day'.
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By Flyin'Dutch'
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1899302
The exam needs to be passed not understood.

The theory needs to be understood but the way exams are written and structured does not guarantee a pass necessary.

I've never yet failed one but that was more due to exam training than personal brilliance, worst was HP for UK CPL. Bonkers.
By IWF
#1899315
As I say the easy ppl site seems to be able to provide the model answer for each question, so when you get something wrong you know where you went wrong.

What I'd find useful is the model answer, but with clear guidance it's not to be shared, or published.

In my case it was having deviation described as being -5 degrees west that still confuses me
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By nickwilcock
#1899320
Old Air Law. 2012. Shoreham. Go into room. Find piece of paper with multiple choice questions and some answers marked already (incorrectly in one case). 5 mins later job done.


The exam custodian should have rejected your sitting, destroyed the paper and set a different paper.

It was the lamentable lack of security and level of cheating in UK PPL exams which led to the current e-Exam system and requirement for invigilation by Ground Examiners.

Anyone caught cheating or distributing actual questions and answers will be dealt with very harshly and quite rightly so.
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By TrickyWoo
#1899321
archerflyer wrote:This time round I felt I really knew the subjects and alot more confident when the question style was more complex than it had to be.


I thought I'd forget some of the the knowledge even after 3 months but much of it came back on a night rating course last week. Especially the FRTOL actually. First proper ATC and no worries. The main bits were still there because the course drummed them in. The way the material is all genuinely relevant (to survival!) is excellent and even the history behind the questions - as in everything you learn wasn't learned by someone else and that's why it's a question now' is a salutary . 'This Is Serious' education. Rather than just training for say an IT exam with a memory dump and a certificate.

I thought the Easy PPL course was fascinating and fantastic. I hope I'll have the good sense to revisit it every year.
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By TrickyWoo
#1899323
nickwilcock wrote:
Old Air Law. 2012. Shoreham. Go into room. Find piece of paper with multiple choice questions and some answers marked already (incorrectly in one case). 5 mins later job done.

It was the lamentable lack of security and level of cheating in UK PPL exams which led to the current e-Exam system and requirement for invigilation by Ground Examiners.


I feel that I learnt an enormous amount of fascinating info on engines...law...weather (especially) and so many other things. That alone was brilliant but to actually apply it in an 'I'm flying at night and I know I won't see the PAPIs until I'm on final at night at 1500" above people's homes as they're enjoying their dinner...it's the most vital learning I've ever done.

However...to enter the debating society...it can't have been that bad before because PA28s aren't piling in to Oxford annually and even without the Sainted Sky Demon pilots more or less seem to have got to their destinations. My plane's 54. They must have been doing something right.
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By lobstaboy
#1899339
I’m firmly with @nickwilcock on this. Too many people treat the exams trivially.
They can’t tell you what the question and right answer is - too easy for unscrupulous folk to build up a bank of known questions and answers.
And as I keep saying - you need to know this stuff, not simply to pass the exams but because you actually need to know this stuff…
It’s not like exams at school. All they are trying to do is to establish that you meet a minimum standard of understanding that is needed for you to be a safe pilot
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