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Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Fri Jan 07, 2022 4:46 pm
by T6Harvard
Sounds perfect to me!
Nice to have those exams done :thumleft:

I'm bashing EasyPPL Groundschool until my first 2022 lesson (wx looks promising for Monday :mrgreen: )

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Fri Jan 07, 2022 6:50 pm
by Milty
Indeed it was good to get those exams out the way. It shocked me a bit when I failed ops procedures before but on reflection, I didn't study enough so only myself to blame really. It's been a long time since I've had to study information and regurgitate it in an exam and I'm not a fan but it's got to be done.

I've got comms and met to look at next. Have you done those?

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Fri Jan 07, 2022 8:41 pm
by T6Harvard
Comms was really straight forward, you'll ace it.
Haven't dared look at Met yet :shock:

I am hoping to feel confident enough to book AGK within the next fortnight. Getting good results on tests and mock exams but it's a big question bank so it may be luck of the draw. I'll put in some intense swotting before I actually book :D

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Sat Jan 08, 2022 9:40 am
by Milty
I meant to add a comment that is relevant to the human performance exam that I took yesterday and also a recent thread on here about how simple maths in the air is more challenging than you think it should be.

One of the legs of my nav was 24 minutes and start at 09:52. I amazed myself at how stupid I seemed in not being able to add 24 minutes to 09:52 whilst keeping straight and level and check gross error points etc. The longer I took to work it out, the harder it was to do and then I started to doubt that I had it right.

I know it will improve with time and familiarity but thought I’d share my experience in case others experience the same.

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Sat Jan 08, 2022 10:08 am
by T6Harvard
Yes! So...

Always start timing in the full hour so as not to need to think of adding a bit to get to 60, then add what's left over! :lol: :lol: :lol:
Ooh, and
Always fly at 90kts and remember to 'divide by 3 then times by 2' to get per hour

Easy :mrgreen:

You are right, it's crazy that SIMPLE maths evades me at altitudes above 5' 3"

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Sat Jan 08, 2022 10:57 am
by lobstaboy
Milty wrote:... simple maths in the air is more challenging than you think it should be.

One of the legs of my nav was 24 minutes and start at 09:52. I amazed myself at how stupid I seemed in not being able to add 24 minutes to 09:52 whilst keeping straight and level and check gross error points etc. The longer I took to work it out, the harder it was to do and then I started to doubt that I had it right.

I know it will improve with time and familiarity but thought I’d share my experience in case others experience the same.


This is very common. And since you need to do that sort of maths a lot it is worth having a strategy. My strategy for blocks of time that go over the hour is this:
Two steps. 09:52 is 8 minutes short of the hour. Take 8 minutes off :24 minutes - answer 16 minutes. So the leg will end at 10:16.
Think of the minute hand on a clock sweeping round and you can see why this works.
I'm sitting at the kitchen table and I still had to do it that way...

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Sat Jan 08, 2022 4:55 pm
by Duncan M
Or get an analogue watch with a bezel and just set pointer and read off required elapsed time.
Lobstaboy, your method works fine but those numbers are relatively easy to work with.
What about 1043 adding 23 minutes?
Easy just to do an addition sum on the map or plog.
10 43
+ 23
= 66
10 h +60 mins =11h and then add the remaining 6
ETA 1106

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Sat Jan 08, 2022 5:09 pm
by Milty
I have been thinking about getting a stopwatch or analogue watch for my knee pad as I agree that it’s easier to visualise. Or I might just set an analogue screen on my Apple Watch thingy (might as well use one other feature on it over and above tracking steps).

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Sun Jan 09, 2022 2:09 am
by Cessna571
Duncan M wrote:Or get an analogue watch with a bezel and just set pointer and read off required elapsed time.
Lobstaboy, your method works fine but those numbers are relatively easy to work with.
What about 1043 adding 23 minutes?
Easy just to do an addition sum on the map or plog.
10 43
+ 23
= 66
10 h +60 mins =11h and then add the remaining 6
ETA 1106



10:43 + 23 ?

17 to the end of the hour, and I take that off 23 to leave 6.

6 past the next hour.

Quick and easy for any numbers.


As an aside…
When I do it though, my mind visualises 43 as a shape, and the 17 as quite a spiky shape that completes the hour. I almost don’t have to think of the 60, my mind sees a spiky shape slotting into the 43, I can then subtract it from the 23, leaving 6, which is a nice shape.
I see numbers as shapes, and it sort of “just happens” visually inside my head. I don’t verbalise it.
Odd eh.

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Sun Jan 09, 2022 2:16 am
by Cessna571
Milty wrote:I have been thinking about getting a stopwatch or analogue watch for my knee pad as I agree that it’s easier to visualise. Or I might just set an analogue screen on my Apple Watch thingy (might as well use one other feature on it over and above tracking steps).


:thumleft:

I bought a cheap ish (£35) analogue wrist watch that I used for my training.

(I treated myself to an original Smiths 1967 6B when I passed, but it’s now waiting for it’s service as it’s missed one due covid and isn’t keeping time very well.
Old mechanical watches need their regular services!)

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Sun Jan 09, 2022 9:08 am
by Rob P
I love all the 'simple' formula for addition when calculating times. They work beautifully on the ground!

I can't offer one that works in the air for me because I never found one. As luck would have it, as in so many bit of flying, SkyDemon has made the problem largely go away.

Of those offered, a cheap wrist watch with rotating bezel looks the most practical.

Rob P

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Sun Jan 09, 2022 9:51 am
by Milty
Thanks all for the suggestions. I’m quite a visual person so will try setting my watch face to analogue and see if that helps. Also, having experienced it once, I’m hoping mentally to be a bit more prepared. Most things in my flying learning have got a bit easier the second, third, fourth time etc. and often with help and tips from the forumites.

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Fri Jan 14, 2022 8:52 am
by Milty
Just recording for posterity - today's lesson cancelled due to fog :(

Expected it to be. I don't think yesterdays fog cleared from Glos until mid-afternoon. Picks up a lot of moisture from the end of the Severn and in a bit of a bowl of hills.

Oh well, best do some work instead.

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:32 pm
by ericgreveson
Ah, shame! Hope the weather is better for you next time. I was hoping to be able to do another lesson this weekend - but no aircraft / instructor availability so will have to wait until Wednesday. At least the forecast looks pretty good so far! I'm getting withdrawal symptoms after only 2 days since my last flight...

Re: New Student - Gloucester

PostPosted:Fri Jan 14, 2022 3:52 pm
by T6Harvard
Ha, @ericgreveson beat me today!

Shame about the fog, Milty.

Wx looks good for me on Monday, guys :)