Learning to fly, or thinking of learning? Post your questions, comments and experiences here

Moderator: AndyR

By Fellsteruk
#1850792
Hey everyone,

Thanks for all the kind words, I’ll be honest now I’ve slept on it and had time to think “worse thing” I actually feel a little worse or more to the point I think the experience has knocked my confidence a bit I’m gonna have a chat with my instructor and an hour on grass airfield so I’m hoping I’ll feel better once I’ve got back in the little cherry and a solo flight under my wings.

@Nero happy to give a synopsis. I have a tendency to waffle on so I’ll try be brief but I may struggle on that one.

I’d agreed to be at the school for 12 and on my way their 11:20 get a call to ask why I was late. then had a delay with a crash on the M56 and another crash in Queensferry, wasn’t involved in them they just delayed me. Arrived for 12:20 turns out they had asked me to come for 11 but the message didn’t send. Was all good in the end as the cherry wasn’t booked till1:30 but as I’m sure you can imagine I was feeling pretty stressed.

Route was Hawarden, Stone, Church Stretton then Hawarden.

Sat down had a drink and settled in one of the briefing rooms with a great view of the runway, did my mass n balance, performance calculations but on a 2,000 meter runway no real doubt I wouldn't have enough :) did my sky demon plog then copied to my chart and did some gross error check.

I didn’t pick up on it at this stage but I was very close to Manchester Space at 2,500 which was my cruise level. I can only guess the stress to get prep done lead to this mistake, checked weather notams and shouted the examiner I was ready.

He did the brief was really nice kept reenforcing he’s not looking for perfect he’s looking for safe and said we make mistakes if you do it doesn’t mean a fail so keep going and don’t let it bother you reviewed my plog, plan, paperwork and off we went to the plane.

Startup, taxi and departure was all good, I’d asked for permission to turn downwind so I could set my heading from the runway mid point to ensure I was on best track and not parallel a few miles off.

Thermals where mental and with the heat she was climbing like a three leg donkey, was at this point the examiner pointed out my intended level may be an issue sure enough I’d missed airspace which I was close too a little too close and wasn’t following “take two” the mistake I mentioned before.

At this point I was proper shaken as I’d done similar leg many times before with and without my FI and was thinking at the time what on earth have a missed and a bust of airspace is a fail simple as, so all I could think was “he doesn’t think I’m safe I’ve failed” this was about 15mins into the flight.

Nominated a new height, he was ok and heading was actually pretty good but with thermals I was proper struggling.

Half way I checked time and updated him I was 1min late and revised time, all good. At this point I’d planned to change to shawbury zone but I was still distracted by the mistake before and I stayed with hawarden radar till Stone I’d not even keyed it in on standby which I always normally do.

Anyway switched to shawbury and a little after turning over Stone got a basic service for some general handling, at this point we did:
- 180 rate one turn out of IMC
- asked me to plan a divert from overhead shawbury to wrexham, drew me line shared heading, distance and time
- asked me to get a position fix using a vor/dme of choice I used shawbury.

Position fix was good put me near Newton look out and there it was “massive lake next door” jobs done.

Not yet anyway at this point I knew where I was but viz was poor, very hazy was then told your lost, I had no map and was asked to track a vor radial to shawbury overhead where I should start my diversion I already had it tuned and identified and I fiddled with the OBI knob/thing and was yeah it’s 270 but for some reason my brain just “$h#t the bed” and despite doing the hard work didn’t turn to 270 I just kept going was on about 190 I knew I was missing something but I was just blank didn’t know what I was missing.

Examiner who was a proper gent said , right you’ve got it tuned, identified and you’ve given me a heading, what you missing about your heading

At this point I was like “turn on the heading you ding bat” had another little fiddle and settles on 280 which I tracked got a matz approved at exactly 2100 on QFE no easy task when thermals are about and given that only takes you just above the ATZ was trying to hold it as best I could.

Left the matz, switched to hawarden radar for more general handling. At this point I asked if the examiner could pass me my water, he took pity I think and also took the controls whilst I had a sip and opened the worlds smallest window for some fresh air.

Climbed to 3500 did my Hasell checks and was briefed to do the following thankfully one by one and after claiming back up and hell checks:
- Straight n level 60kt
- clean stall from above config
- approach stall in turn to final
- landing config stall
- descending steep turn “had to repeat that as I was too fast first time around”
- 360 degree steep turn first left then right

We then started to head north, at this point I was conscious no “emergencies” had happened so kinda knew what was coming but again at this point I was pretty spent mentally.

As you guessed it engine failure, picked a field into wind, 70kt glide, checks, 7700, mayday and all that jazz then headed for field was a little high so i side slipped eventually I climbed away only for him to pull an EFATO, did it ok my only issue was my field was a little more than 30degrees of the nose but he was ok, again climbed away.

Asked me to head for hawarden, normally from south of wrexham on a most days you can see the runcorn bridge the Mersey all kinds. Today just haze however I knew if I head north slightly north west for a few mins I should be able to make out Chester and bee line, sure enough that worked for me and joined left base for 22.

I’m gonna just say this now, I’d been flying at this point for over two hours in 25c heat and pretty certain I’d failed from my previous airspace gaff, I didn’t bust it but that fact I could have being so close was sure it was done deal and general lack of height control, I think the tolerance was/is 150ft.

Asked the tower for circuits first landing was normal and touched down on the numbers but it was a shocking approach, landing a little harder than normal but main gear then nose so it was safe.

2nd landing flapless, on approach I only go and put first stage in but before I let go of the flap stick “that’s what it is in a Cherokee” lol I dumped it, said sorry and advised that was my muscle memory thankfully it didn’t cause an issue.

However that gaff did have me forgetting to trim to 70/75 and I was coming in fast and way to high, I said to him, I’m going to go around as I won’t make my touchdown marking he asked me to give it a go anyway. Managed to bleed off my extra speed in the flare, again got down on the main gear but didn’t put enough cross wind correction in so again not pretty but safe. Thankfully I wasn’t too long and was able to liftoff “hawarden is a long runway”

I know what was coming because he’d asked me to request a RH circuit, as we’re downwind he said “I want you to pull the throttle at any point past the threshold when you think you can make the runway from 1000ft.

At this point I paused and looked blank I guess this because he said “do you understand what I’m asking you to do” up to this point when doing these my instructor had always pulled the throttle so it threw me because I was like when do I pull it?

Anyway I felt like I was in Good position told the tower I was commencing glide and off I went, to be fair and looking back I maybe shouldn’t have turned to the threshold as early as I did as I found I was high and too close, I was trimmed ok and the height soon dropped off I waited until I was just over the fence before using flaps, I’d noticed from the last two the wind was picking up and gusty so I just went with two flaps rather than all three stages and I was glad I did.

As I got closer and just over the extended thresholds massive gust blew me off the centre line and took almost full right aileron “felt like it did” to correct and stay level managed to get back on the runway and plopped her down again on main gear but harder than normal.

At that moment I was thinking should I go around? If I do I’ll have to do this again... if I can get level and back on centre we’re doing this and I committed to it.

Three of my worst landings for sure, no question but all down safe without damage to me or the cherry so whilst the guys at the hold will have been saying WTF “one was actually my instructor” lol, I got down.

Was a bit fast to get off at G so let her run and came off at A and a long silent taxi back and park.

He jumped out and said he’d meet me inside for debrief, I just sat there with the wind blowing threw the door for a bit before packing my stuff and walking back the school.

Debrief was about an hour, had a good chat and got lots of really good feedback from the examiner some about my performance on certain tasks but then some other things to consider and think about.

By this point it was about 5:30pm so I decided rather than apply for license in the school I’d do it at home and the head of training emailed me the files I’d need for the application.

Sorry Nero that wasn’t very brief :(
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By T6Harvard
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1850803
Oh man! I am exhausted @Fellsteruk . That was tough.
But.but.but - given all the pressure piling up (arrival time, delays, wind, haze, the one issue re alt), you coped with All That and satisfied the examiner you were competent and safe. Ok, so you know you have been flying better, but QED, you will fly better again.

Thank you so much for the write up, btw. Cathartic? Maybe too soon.

Good idea to have an hour off grass and maybe even an hour's bimble with an instructor so the flying feels good again. It will!!

Come on, you have (well, when the postie delivers it) your very own Pilot's Licence. You are a bona fide pilot. Bravo!

PS, you going to Sleap for Flyer fly in?
#1850805
Sounds like a very normal skills test compared to what I normally see as an FE! You have really good self awareness and self critique which will give any examiner confidence that you are a diligent pilot. Well done on the pass in hard working conditions!

Ps it’s quite normal to have ‘imposter syndrome’ after passing - the FE has awarded you a PPL pass so enjoy it!
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By Nero
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1850810
Not a problem at all! I loved reading it, even if it did make me think I've got a hell of a lot to refresh this summer to be able to do this in a test...

That's the thing with tests. We know we can do every part of it and could fly perfectly happily on our own, but we have to prove it all in one marathon session with a stranger.

But you've done just that!

I'm sure you're still in emotional turmoil from it but you also need to remember that you're a qualified pilot now :) the real learning begins and you should go out there and enjoy the summer!

Oh and Ms Harvard, I'll update my own thread soon but not had a lot to say with only one lesson since that part of lockdown ended.

Can't wait to get back in the saddle and tick off some of the above!!

~ Scott
By Fellsteruk
#1850827
Thanks again you guys are so supportive I really enjoy spending time in the forum and it’s you guys that make it a community worth being apart of.

@T6Harvard not sure I was looking at some in the summer but with sleap only a 20min flight away I may providing I can get some experience in before that as I expect it will be mental.

I’ve actually been thinking of joining Shropshire Aero Club after I got my license, I wanna stay with my school at hawarden as it’s a good base and I can night fly but my school of it’s six babies only one is a Cherokee and me being, well fat I’m limited it’s also only a 140 so realistically with me on board it’s a two seater if you wanted to fly with a decent endurance.

Sleap, I’m told have some nice 172’s with a bigger MTOW than the PA28-140 I fly now. Maybe I can attend the flyin and meet the club two birds one stone, you going?

@MattL thanks for that, I’m big on imposter syndrome almost everyday at work I tell myself someone is gonna discover I’m actually clueless and fire my a$$ :) I intend to enjoy it and get out and about and slowly push my distance I’d love to fly up to preswick but I’m gonna work up to that as it’s a long slog there and back.

@Nero again thanks. As you said on the day it’s a lot to do with a stranger and likely a level of stress few PPLs ever get themselves into in real life, I’d like to hope.

You’ll smash it and whilst it is a lot it’s just what you’ve been learning all this time and trained to do :)
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By Fellsteruk
#1850845
T6Harvard wrote:@Fellsteruk Flyer forum fly in - Unfortunately I shall be travelling home from a family visit to Scotland that weekend, would have loved to be there!


Never mind will be plenty more :) I’ve requested the Cherokee for the afternoon of the 3rd if it gets confirmed I’ll have to book it.
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By TopCat
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1850887
MattL wrote:Ps it’s quite normal to have ‘imposter syndrome’ after passing

And no bad thing, possibly.

I'm absolutely not for a moment knocking @Fellsteruk 's undoubted achievement, it's a long way to come from nothing, and I'm absolutely delighted for him.

But the reality is that with the ink barely dry on a PPL, a pilot is very inexperienced indeed, and staying safe will depend on a high level of self-awareness, an ongoing commitment to high standards, and the patience to push out the boundaries of that comfort zone in smallish and hence safe increments.

The last thing you want is to come away from a Skills Test thinking "actually I'm a pretty good pilot", with its risk of complacency.

@Fellsteruk I'll be interested to hear your perspective on the last year or so when you've got another 50 hours under your belt.

When I got to 100 hours I looked back and wondered how in hell I'd got a pass, and it was another several hundred before I started to really feel like I knew what I was doing.

'Started' mind you. My imposter syndrome has never fully gone away.
davenuk, T6Harvard and 1 others liked this
#1850918
MattL wrote:Sounds like a very normal skills test compared to what I normally see as an FE! You have really good self awareness and self critique which will give any examiner confidence that you are a diligent pilot. Well done on the pass in hard working conditions!

Ps it’s quite normal to have ‘imposter syndrome’ after passing - the FE has awarded you a PPL pass so enjoy it!


Yes I agree - the examiner isn't looking for perfection. They're making sure you know what you're doing. Your write up demonstrates that you do. Mind you it's meant to be hard work and a bit stressful - how you cope with that is part of the assessment.
Congrats and have lots of fun, safely.
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