Learning to fly, or thinking of learning? Post your questions, comments and experiences here

Moderator: AndyR

By trojanbob
#1842038
I have just started my flight training, I am using my local club with their Robin HR200 2 seater.

I am estimating roughly £10k-15k - finding this guy as a guide: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0

Are there any tips or ways to look at it? There is a lot of information and I just want to be clear on a study plan. For example should I look at PPL cruiser, airquiz

Is there a good way to do it intensely? I have the next two months with a lot of flexibility and could look into 6 or so lessons a week to make a lot of momentum while I have the time!

Finally - what would be considered reasonable prices in the North? £160 p/h all in?
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By Rob P
#1842058
It can be done intensively, and you might save an hour or two (you won't complete in 45 hours unless you are exceptional)

In doing so you will reach the stage of terrifying your friends and loved ones sooner, and miss out on the pleasure of a more relaxed timetable, extracting maximum enjoyment from some of the most enjoyable flying experience you will have.

It's not like driving lessons, to be got out of the way before you get the freedom of the skies. You'll be solo cross-country far sooner than you might expect.

Rob P

And welcome :D
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By Morten
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1842076
£160/hr all in (aircraft, instructor, landing fees?) sounds cheap to me although you may want to check how they define an hour (ie flight time, 'hobbs', engine start/stop time ?)
Overall budget of 10-15k sound about right, though.

As for compressing it over 6 weeks - I always suggest that you should do your license at a similar rate to how you will fly once you have it. As @Rob P says, you will be soloing before you get your license anyway and the license is not a goal in itself, it's just a step along your aviating career. Flying > 45 hours in 2 months and then falling back to the occasional weekend flight would be a shame. The lessons will be some of the most enjoyable flying you will do and taking time to enjoy it is not a bad thing. Unless of course you want to rush through it to then go on to other things like an ATPL etc.

Whatever you decide, have fun :thumleft:
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By TopCat
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1842089
Rob P wrote:It can be done intensively, and you might save an hour or two (you won't complete in 45 hours unless you are exceptional)

In doing so you will reach the stage of terrifying your friends and loved ones sooner, and miss out on the pleasure of a more relaxed timetable, extracting maximum enjoyment from some of the most enjoyable flying experience you will have.

It's not like driving lessons, to be got out of the way before you get the freedom of the skies. You'll be solo cross-country far sooner than you might expect.

I wouldn't have believed this if someone had said it to me when I was a new PPL student, but Rob has absolutely hit the nail on the head here.

Learning this lesson early - dare I say, more so than the flying itself - is key to getting the absolute maximum possible out of ab initio training.

By the time I passed my GFT (the 1990s equivalent of the skills test), I had 52:50 dual, and 14:20 solo, over about 10 months in all.

So nearly 70 hours. But this included 4 hours on instruments, spinning in a C150 aerobat with an RAF Phantom pilot, nearly 4 hours in the USA (one where the instructor got sick), and some of the most golden memories of nearly 30 years flying, sometimes in in weather worse than I'd fly in now, and often out of sequence and yet still with bags of learning to be had.

The secret is to find an instructor that doesn't treat the PPL course as a sausage machine, with exercises to be covered in the prescribed order or not at all. I was incredibly lucky in this regard.

The other secret is to view it all as a process, not an outcome. The award of the PPL is just a milestone along the way.
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#1842092
I'm paying roughly £160 p/h at my school up here in the North East. That's brakes off to brakes on and inc. landing fee. It varies - in my first couple of lessons we've been a few minutes late in which knocks it up a bit - but all counts towards your flying hours. Find a school with low-landing fees, Newcastle would've been a budget killer which informed my choice.

My school (and I believe this is fairly common) offer a discount for setting up an account and they offer a % based on fees deposited, but it's paltry, and might add up to an extra lesson or two over the course of the whole PPL. Different schools have different options but I couldn't find a package deal outside of the major training companies. Personally I'm glad, because the lessons so far have been exhausting, there's a lot of study, prep and scribing things into the brain between lessons. But everyone learns in different ways.

I would say my experience has been that there are a lot of costs that come along with PPL training as is shown in the spreadsheet,and you can make a lot of savings. I got my books from Ebay - £40 all in with a flight bag. Used headset from one of the FIs - £100. CRP-1 Facebook Marketplace for £20 etc. It's mostly all pennies saved really, but pennies that can be spent on air time.

I've been using PPL tutor on teh iPhone along with the Pooleys practice tests for the theory stuff. They've both been a real help and with PPL tutor you can keep track of your pass stats. I'm sure there are other apps out there too.

Hope that's of some help - I'm only just starting myself.
Last edited by editmonkey on Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
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By trojanbob
#1842210
Thanks for all the advice.

Just to be clear - I definitely enjoy it and find it a great fun hobby - but getting to the airport and back etc takes time so I am trying to look at more compact options? For example, doing a 2-hour flight instead of 1 hour.

There is also the fact I will be moving in around a year and would like to get qualified by then.
By trojanbob
#1842211
TopCat wrote:
Rob P wrote:It can be done intensively, and you might save an hour or two (you won't complete in 45 hours unless you are exceptional)

In doing so you will reach the stage of terrifying your friends and loved ones sooner, and miss out on the pleasure of a more relaxed timetable, extracting maximum enjoyment from some of the most enjoyable flying experience you will have.

It's not like driving lessons, to be got out of the way before you get the freedom of the skies. You'll be solo cross-country far sooner than you might expect.

I wouldn't have believed this if someone had said it to me when I was a new PPL student, but Rob has absolutely hit the nail on the head here.

Learning this lesson early - dare I say, more so than the flying itself - is key to getting the absolute maximum possible out of ab initio training.

By the time I passed my GFT (the 1990s equivalent of the skills test), I had 52:50 dual, and 14:20 solo, over about 10 months in all.

So nearly 70 hours. But this included 4 hours on instruments, spinning in a C150 aerobat with an RAF Phantom pilot, nearly 4 hours in the USA (one where the instructor got sick), and some of the most golden memories of nearly 30 years flying, sometimes in in weather worse than I'd fly in now, and often out of sequence and yet still with bags of learning to be had.

The secret is to find an instructor that doesn't treat the PPL course as a sausage machine, with exercises to be covered in the prescribed order or not at all. I was incredibly lucky in this regard.

The other secret is to view it all as a process, not an outcome. The award of the PPL is just a milestone along the way.


So if a instructor covers the exercises in order that is bad? I am not sure what I am looking for in a good instructor really - I like mine and that seems good to me
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By T6Harvard
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1842214
Certainly at first an hour is enough! You will be tired because your lessons are going to be pretty packed with stuff.
Later, on cross country nav exercises lessons will be more than an hour. My school does let some students train more intensely but they insist on rest breaks if you are circuit bashing, for obvious reasons.

I travelled 90 mins each way to my airfield but it is a lovely journey through beautiful countryside so I am lucky. It does, of course, add to the cost but there was no real alternative.
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By Fellsteruk
#1842219
Firstly good luck and enjoy.

I would suggest you do as much as you can in so much as you not too tired as T6 said some lessons really whack it out of you. I’ve only had a couple 2 hours lessons and it was hard going. Not ideal if you have a trek to the airport but what may be better and something I’ve tried in the past and found very nice and worked well is to have two lessons but with a gap between them, this gives you say two hours of lessons but you get twice the ground work, taxiing, landing etc I would do say a 9am lesson grab some lunch then head back for the next lesson. Sadly my airport is now too far away for that.

It’s not rocket science but it’s still a lot of subject matter to learn to pass the written exams and it’s important you know the topic rather than the question banks.

I cannot recommend enough the pooley books but also the exam prep guides I found both invaluable in passing my exams and given you’ll need to have passed air law and in some schools ops I’d suggest you get reading especially if you go down the intensive route so you can solo when your ready.

Also get your medical sorted, again you’ll need this for first solo which may come quick so best to have it in the bag.

As I said good luck and enjoy it, no pun intended but the road to getting your ppl is fun of ups n downs and some lessons will stink but so long as your still enjoying it that’s all that matters.
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By TopCat
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1842226
trojanbob wrote:So if a instructor covers the exercises in order that is bad?

No of course not. That absolutely is not bad. If the weather cooperates with the plan, and that works for you, it's fine.

I am not sure what I am looking for in a good instructor really - I like mine and that seems good to me

Great!
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