Learning to fly, or thinking of learning? Post your questions, comments and experiences here

Moderator: AndyR

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By GrahamB
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1605303
If people want to selfie/video themselves for whatever reason that's fine by me, but just don't make my life less enjoyable while you are doing it (art galleries, Grand Canyon, blah blah).

Oh, and please don't expect me to find the results in any way interesting.
#1605320
Fitrus wrote:Thank you for all the replies.

My current instructor doesnt allow to mount camera anywhere in the aircraft. I use to fly with my instructor's partner in the same flying club and same aircraft whom did not have any problem with me filming my lessons with my Gopro.

I like to watch my videos and listen to the audios just to revise and to see my mistakes etc.

Maybe this new instructor doesnt want anyone watching him so aggresive on instructor seat :D :cyclopsani:


Or maybe he just doesn't want to be captured on video while working? Like most of us probably don't. Maybe he doesn't want you to have the ability to plaster him all over the internet? I certainly don't want you to have footage of me that you can do whatever you like with.

If you can't work out for yourself that such a request would probably make just about any instructor feel uncomfortable (in any sphere, it's not a flying matter) - between not wanting to be your internet co-star and not wanting to offend by refusing - then you probably need to take a good hard look at your people skills.

Concentrate on learning to fly. It's not something to be done while fiddling with audio-visual kit and concerning yourself with how things will appear on the film afterwards. Apart from anything else you've just made it that much harder for yourself because your instructors 'dickhead radar' has probably gone off.
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#1605325
Using a GoPro could be very useful as a debrief tool, as long as it's under the instructors control. I have done sim sessions that have been videoed and it is really enlightening to see how you behave under stressful conditions. Delete after debrief.
#1605327
I feel the need to say, possibly because it's the student forum, that the idea the OP wants to plaster himself and his instructor all over the internet is introduced in the replies. Although the OP did not specifically say he would not post on the internet, or even share, I do believe he said the intention was to use the video for reviewing his lessons.

I can see the value in that. :thumleft:

Bit unfair for forumrites to apply their own agenda. :naughty:

Can't help but conclude some posters unusually unhelpful and rather aggressive responses are borne out of their own prejudices. :(

@defcribed it's bad enough asserting the OP will do something he has not indicated he will do, to extrapolate to talk of 'dickhead radar' has set my 'dickhead radar' off! :wink:
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By defcribed
#1605345
Misc - if someone films or photographs you then it's essentially out there in the ether as soon as it's done. The person who took it controls it, not you, and no matter how much you think you might trust them, once they share it with anyone else then it's out there in the wild.

Most people who video an activity of any sort, be it flying, bungee jumping or underwater basket-weaving, post it somewhere.

All I'm trying to point out is that by even asking an instructor if they can do it they're causing a problem. Most instructors (most people) would rather not if they had the choice, but they may also be worried about causing offence if they refuse. It's a no-win situation. I'd have hoped that someone considering the idea would have had the forethought to figure this out and not ask in the first place. If it really is a learning aid of any value for debriefing then I'm sure the instructor or school would suggest it.
By Cryogenng
#1605350
I film most of my lessons and find it an invaluable aid to learning. Could I learn without it? Sure. But there's a lot to take in, in a short space of time in the air, and I personally find it very useful to look at things again and see whether I'm really getting what the instructor is telling me. And shaking my head at the mistakes I make on the radio sometimes :)

I asked for permission from both the school and for the instructor each time, and mount the camera in such a way where it doesn't obstruct the view out of the window
#1605352
defcribed wrote:Most people who video an activity of any sort, be it flying, bungee jumping or underwater basket-weaving, post it somewhere.

All I'm trying to point out is that by even asking an instructor if they can do it they're causing a problem. Most instructors (most people) would rather not if they had the choice, but they may also be worried about causing offence if they refuse. It's a no-win situation. I'd have hoped that someone considering the idea would have had the forethought to figure this out and not ask in the first place. If it really is a learning aid of any value for debriefing then I'm sure the instructor or school would suggest it.

In your own words you say most... :wink: and you may well be correct, however to come on a forum with such an assumption to aggressively state what you have (putting words in his mouth and then slating him for those words) I find a tad unnecessary, when in fact you have no knowledge of the forumite posting the question.

If you read through the thread you will see another 'dick head's' decision to ask the question of the school and FI paid dividends for him. :thumleft: Although having spent 15-20 mins on the phone to that particular forumite just yesterday I'm very much of the opinion he is far from being a dick head. :wink:
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By rikur_
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1605395
I didn't film any of my lessons.
Some time after, some ex-colleagues bought me a GoPro as a leaving present - and I then filmed probably 10 - 15 flights until the novelty wore off.
I found it quite helpful reviewing after the event - both spotting my own mistakes, but also some critical other pilots making observations. I certainly learnt from it.
I wish we'd also had a Shoreham style runway camera, I'm sure that would have helped me understand what was going wrong with my landing technique.

I learnt the hard way though that once footage is out there, you can't get it back - with the Daily Mail and ITN using my footage without permission as part of their coverage of a fatal accident :( .
#1605432
Miscellaneous wrote:
defcribed wrote:Most people who video an activity of any sort, be it flying, bungee jumping or underwater basket-weaving, post it somewhere.

All I'm trying to point out is that by even asking an instructor if they can do it they're causing a problem. Most instructors (most people) would rather not if they had the choice, but they may also be worried about causing offence if they refuse. It's a no-win situation. I'd have hoped that someone considering the idea would have had the forethought to figure this out and not ask in the first place. If it really is a learning aid of any value for debriefing then I'm sure the instructor or school would suggest it.

In your own words you say most... :wink: and you may well be correct, however to come on a forum with such an assumption to aggressively state what you have (putting words in his mouth and then slating him for those words) I find a tad unnecessary, when in fact you have no knowledge of the forumite posting the question.

If you read through the thread you will see another 'dick head's' decision to ask the question of the school and FI paid dividends for him. :thumleft: Although having spent 15-20 mins on the phone to that particular forumite just yesterday I'm very much of the opinion he is far from being a dick head. :wink:


I'm trying to put myself in the shoes of an instructor who receives such a request. The fact that a student tells you they won't put it on the internet, or that they have no plans to put it on the internet, doesn't mean that it won't end up on the internet.

What happens when the student falls out with the school or the instructor and starts slagging them off? What happens when a video of you giving a lesson (which maybe wasn't the best one you ever gave) appears on YouTube, selectively edited to make you look like a prat, a tyrant or just plain incompetent?

This adds nothing at all and is just a distraction. The student is there to learn to fly, not to make movies. Want to spot your mistakes? The instructor will spot them for you, that's what he or she is paid for. You probably won't spot them.

To those who've said they do this - I guarantee you that your instructor reluctantly tolerates it rather than embraces it, whatever they may say to your face. Instructors don't want to lose students, especially ones who fly (and pay) regularly.

I'm into old man mode now, but this is really just another example of how people in the modern world seem unable to just get on and do things. If they're seeing or doing something fun or exciting, being in the moment just isn't enough anymore, they have to have their cameras or phones out photographing it or videoing it. Do something, see something, enjoy it and keep the memories. You don't need a photo or a video of it.
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By defcribed
#1605438
Cryogenng wrote:I film most of my lessons and find it an invaluable aid to learning. Could I learn without it? Sure. But there's a lot to take in, in a short space of time in the air, and I personally find it very useful to look at things again and see whether I'm really getting what the instructor is telling me. And shaking my head at the mistakes I make on the radio sometimes :)

I asked for permission from both the school and for the instructor each time, and mount the camera in such a way where it doesn't obstruct the view out of the window


With the greatest respect Cryogenng, 99.9999% of people who've ever learnt to fly have done it without having their lessons filmed. So I think 'invaluable' might be coming it a bit high in terms of the usefulness.

Also, you don't know what negative effects it might have. You can bet your bottom dollar that the instructor is a bit more tense and keyed-up than they'd normally be, making sure they deliver the syllabus exactly per the book because they know they're being watched and that they're powerless to prevent that video ending up in front of anyone. You might find you get more from them if you let them relax and be themselves.
By Cryogenng
#1605473
I think your opinion is quite apparent to most people reading this :)

This does not however preclude the possibility that some people may find it beneficial and indeed some instructors may be genuinely chilled out about the whole thing.
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By JAFO
#1605500
PaulB wrote:
JAFO wrote:I find it fascinating that the world is divided into those who want to record their life, those who need to share their life with the world and those who are content simply to live it.


Everyone is different.... it'd be boring if we were all the same.


Very true but, as I say, fascinating.
#1605504
JAFO wrote:
PaulB wrote:
JAFO wrote:I find it fascinating that the world is divided into those who want to record their life, those who need to share their life with the world and those who are content simply to live it.


Everyone is different.... it'd be boring if we were all the same.


Very true but, as I say, fascinating.


I think it depends if you’re a member of the “broadcast generation”, basically if you have a Facebook or Twitter account.

Took my 14 year old (air cadet) nephew flying at the weekend.

“Do you want to take pictures/selfies?”

“I might in a bit, I’m just enjoying the experience at the minute”

quite impressed me tbh.
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By Cessna57
#1605533
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:
Cessna57 wrote:
I think it depends if you’re a member of the “broadcast generation”, basically if you have a Facebook or Twitter account.
.


Where do those with a FF account sit?

:roll:

Just asking....


Presuming you mean Flyer Forum, I’d say they discuss things in a forum.

I don’t see anyone posting pictures of each meal they eat here !

I know some use Facebook as a discussion medium, and I myself am a Facebook user, as a “browser”, I know there are quite a lot of people who just broadcast an endless stream of **** though. You can’t deny they exist, I think they may even be the majority.