Learning to fly, or thinking of learning? Post your questions, comments and experiences here

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By rachelandrew
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1546966
Hi all

struggling a bit to not talk utter nonsense on the radio, I fly out of Bristol so feel very much like the new kid amongst all the commercial traffic.

Other than the Pooleys book and CAP 413, has anyone recommendations for good learning or practice materials? Learning the stuff by rote seems to make matters worse. Today they gave my clearance at engine start which I hadn't heard before and completely threw me as I was expecting things in the order of my notes. :oops: Reminds me of when my daughter first went to France after learning French and complained that the French didn't say things in the right order!

Rachel
#1546983
I would thoroughly recommend heading to YouTube and looking up flights - bonus points for finding videos of pilots flying from your home aerodrome! I found this incredibly useful whilst I was training :thumleft:

When I did my FRTOL course, I was given this book to help prepare for the theory and practical exams: http://www.enstoneflyingclub.co.uk/file ... locked.pdf
#1547007
I found that getting a receiver and sit listening to everyone else comm with the tower etc got me used to the process and more comfortable.

Also don't underestimate the value of going and introducing yourself to whoever is on the other end of the radio. It doesn't seem like a big deal but having a face to a voice makes it more like chatting to a friend than an unknown person who you convince yourself is judging you :)
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By Morten
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1547024
I borrowed an airband receiver and listened in on some of the ATC frequencies. My 'eureka' moment was when I realised that really, there are only so many things being said - knowing when to expect what is half the trick. Which is why, like you said, if you get something in an usual order or something you don't expect, it throws you. So the solution is to listen to as much as you can - youtube has lots, and there's also e.g. LiveATC Aviation Audio Feeds (sadly does not cover UK...).

If you want more targeted training, Vicky Farmer at Flyers Flying School offers RT practice over Skype (disclaimer - Vicky was my examiner).

Morten
#1547036
I was fortunate enough to work about 500 metres from the flying school at East Mids when I was learning.
Spent a lot of time listening to the tower using a cheap scanner throughout the day.

It soon becomes very apparrent that there's a very distinct 'script' that it all follows.
As you've pointed out though, it's when the script deviates from what you're used to that can throw you. If that happens then the magic words 'say again' always help, and also in my case, looking cluelessly at my instructor usually got him to help out.

I always felt very intimidated by radio work. Don't worry, it comes in time :)

I also agree with the YouTube video thing. I recorded a few of mine when learning so that I could play them back and see things I'd missed or got wrong... here's one such one from a 'typical' Saturday at East Midlands.



The bits where I'm orbiting and being spaced with the other plane on training, I hadn't had that kind of RT before, and some of the bits where I was proceeding to final was quite ad-hoc too. You'll find it all makes sense in the end :)

Good luck!
#1547042
My instructor and his colleague ran evening classes at Gransden (Cambs), I believe they also run them somewhere near Sandy.

Lots and lots of practical. Basically evenings of virtually flying complicated routes at hyper speed.

I found as soon as I learnt to say "say again xxxxx" for any bits I didn't catch, all was fine.

It took the pressure off me and I usually catch what I need to now. "Say again QNH, G-NN" is fine.
Just don't say "erm, what was that, G-NN"

It's another "don't worry, it gets easier", bit like the whole course really.
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By Irv Lee
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1547050
Some thoughts on radio:
Whilst listening to radio is good, the student needs to understand that many hobby pilots who fly outside controlled airspace are abysmal at formal radio phraseology.
I think (generally) students go solo earlier if they are allowed by their instructors to use the radio (and make mistakes) from very early on, ramping up quickly. There is enough for the brain to bring together in the circuit without getting up to speed on the radio, yet quite a few only get full radio use then.
It is also a shame many do the radio practical as almost the final thing on the ppl course, when it would have been much more useful before first nav for similar reasons..
There was an infringement report where it was obvious an instructor had left real radio use so late that (almost unbelievably) the instructor had had to preset the radio up to the 2 frequencies "probably required" for a student solo nav because the student didn't know how to do it. This started the chain of events that led to an infringement.
As part of the English assessment for qualified pilots as they were applying for EASA licences ((of which I probably did "three figures"), I got a few interesting answers when I put the scenario that they had diverted due weather to a full atc airfield and when they made the downwind call had been told to "orbit", what would they do? Good job it was just a ground scenario and not actually happening for real.
#1547084
Probably not allowed at an ATC unit, but sitting in the tower/radio room listening to both sides of the conversations would let you understand what and why things are being said. If they will let you, they are only human , mostly, just like the rest of us. :D
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By kingbing
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1547137
I'm a PPL student at North Weald. I found a visit to the tower (A/G) there really useful and hospitable. Seeing whet they saw and how and why they organised things the way they did was a real help in getting my head around the "why"s. They were happy for me to listen for a bit too. If you have an ATC nearby, give them a ring and ask for a visit.
#1547140
I passed my RT exam a few months ago. Something that helped me was plotting random routes on a chart and then going through the motions of what each individual would say (ground station and pilot).

It helped to put the text and calls into perspective rather than just seeing a wall of writing.

P.S don't worry too much about fluffing the calls early on in your training. I cringe when I think back to some of the errors I made! :oops: