Learning to fly, or thinking of learning? Post your questions, comments and experiences here

Moderator: AndyR

By HarryBo
#1529243
Hello everyone,

A few weeks ago I bought my first issue of FLYER. Coming from the RC world and a lifelong dream to fly, stumbling on the issue including the "Learn to fly guide 2017" was the ultimate excuse to finally take flying more seriously.

I was not sure if I will be able to afford it but after reading @leiafee's guide from his thread post "How To Learn To Fly (sort of)" I thought that it is certainly possible! (thanks for the PDF if you are reading this).

Let me start by saying that I have a few days worth of knowledge on the topic so please correct me wherever I am wrong. Also, don't hesitate to ask for clarifications where needed as I am not a native speaker.

So, after reading FLYER's guide I decided that the LAPL would be sufficient for me. I certainly wanted an EASA licence since my I am not planning on flying anything bigger than a two sitter. I live in west London and I do not own a car. That being said my commute to any airfield that I will choose to take my licence with has to be in a commutable distance by public transport (or bicycle :lol: ). After some Googling I found that "flight training london" and "West London Aero Club" are within less than 2h commute and offer a LAPL.
Are there any other schools you are aware of?
Does anyone have any personal experience with the above schools?

I would also like to know if it is possible to obtain the licence within a month or so taken into account that the theory has been studied before even taking the lessons and that I am at the airfield every other day. I am clearly asking to see if it is worth spending my summer obtaining LAPL abroad, somewhere that prices are more affordable.

Any other info to a total newbie are also welcome and most appreciated.

Thanks :thumleft:
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By leiafee
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1529248
You're welcome :)

Don't know the area, but in the UK, even (some would say especially) in the summer the odds of a solid moth of flyable weather is... slim?

Then too if budget is a factor and you want an intensive course make sure you've left yourself money to fly for the rest of the year...

Intensive courses can be cheaper-to-license, but double (or more) the cost for the whole year. Saving £500 on the cost of training and then discovering you've got to make that £500 last the remaining 11months could be kind of a downer!
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By Morten
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1529259
Hi Harry and welcome on board.

I think most schools will/can offer you a LAPL if you ask for it.

You should pop out to the airfields you found to be within commuting reach (depending on where in west London, Fairoaks, White Waltham, Denham, Elstree?) and have a look around, go for a test flight, see where you feel most at home.

I agree with Leia on the intensive/normal course... The actual lessons are part of your flying experience. You will be flying solo from early on, the licence itself is just another step along the path to gaining experience and becoming a pilot. If you start out flying 40 hours in one month, you'll get very depressed if you cannot continue to fly 40 hours per month thereafter... Maybe better to learn at the pace you will continue flying on afterwards.

Whatever you do, have fun doing it :thumright:

Morten
Last edited by Morten on Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
By MarkOlding
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1529260
Hi,
If you have found West London Aero Club you are looking at White Waltham. I am biased as I am well into my PPL there but like the fact its a club with a proper club atmosphere, there are up to 10 aircraft to do your basic training on and a whole variety of instructors make it a great place to train.
There are 2 other airfields nearby - Booker or Wycombe Air Park and Denham both of which offer flight training. A bit further afield is Blackbushe to the South West.

I would suggest you visit the ones within easy commute and get a feel for what they are like, then pick the one you are happiest with.

Have fun
Cheers
Mark
By ChrisRowland
#1529269
What Leia says...

I've just done a NPPL SSEA conversion at White Waltham and can recommend it as a good place to learn to fly and a good place to sit around watching others flying. Also reasonably priced decent food.

I'd be tempted not to do things too fast, I find that having time to think about what happened last time and rehearse how to avoid the same mistakes next time can help. Aim to fly a couple of times a week. Take your instructor's advice though, someone who has flown with you will be able to give better advice than a bloke on the internet.
By HarryBo
#1529272
leiafee wrote:Then too if budget is a factor and you want an intensive course make sure you've left yourself money to fly for the rest of the year...


Haven't thought of it that way. You are absolutely right. And this is the kind of info I was expecting to find here! The things not mentioned in magazines and blog posts :thumleft:


Morten wrote:I think most schools will/can offer you a LAPL if you ask for it.


Didn't know that. Will keep in mind for the schools I left out because of what was stated in their websites


Morten wrote:You should pop out to the airfields you found to be within commuting reach (depending on where in west London, Fairoaks, White Waltham, Denham, Elstree?) and have a look around, go for a test flight, see where you feel most at home.


MarkOlding wrote:There are 2 other airfields nearby - Booker or Wycombe Air Park and Denham both of which offer flight training. A bit further afield is Blackbushe to the South West.


Wow! I have spent so much time looking online and never stumbled on some of those airfields. I wonder what I am doing wrong :p
Especially Denham airfield is only 1h30m away from me which seems to be the closest one at the moment :D
I will probably find the 3 closest ones and go have a look before committing to anything!!


ChrisRowland wrote:I'd be tempted not to do things too fast, I find that having time to think about what happened last time and rehearse how to avoid the same mistakes next time can help. Aim to fly a couple of times a week.


I was only going to rush them if I was to do them abroad during summer. Since however it seems that most people here seem to agree that this is not the best idea I will probably do it in the UK which means no more than a lesson or two per week.
By Cessna57
#1529287
It recently took me about 18 months to get a license, with 58 hours flying. (Which isn't too bad I reckon)

I'm sure an instructor "could" have got me through in the minimum, but it's not a race, it's all flying.

Infact, now I have a license I'm not enjoying flying solo and am dragging passengers onto the aircraft whenever I can.

Sometimes my old instructor, as he's a fun chap to fly with.

So, no need to rush, the training is so enjoyable, it's not a means to an end, it's an experience all in itself.

I flew every week, when weather permitted and flew in all sorts of weather because it was spread out.

I'd flown through rain, I'd landed at dusk, I'd flown in real clouds as well as with foggles. All sorts of flying, because it was spread out a bit.

Training is like the best "red letter day" you'll ever have, you shouldn't rush it imho.

Travel to each airfield, buy a log book, log each trial lesson (they all count)

You'll be in the Pilot's seat on day one, you'll learn how to fly from day one. My first unassisted landing was probably lesson 4, my first solo, after 18 hours.

It happens very quickly anyway, I don't know the schools in that area, but I know it's worth going and doing a trial lesson at each. I spent a day at my first trial lesson, I wanted to be at an airfield, near aircraft and talk about aviation. Like most pilots, so did they !

Anyway, multiple trial lessons, they all count and you'll find out soon enough which suits you.
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By T67M
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1529290
I'd echo every​ single one of the comments above, but especially the "don't rush" - it really isn't a race, and flying twice a week for six months rather than every waking moment for four-to-six weeks will give you more time to learn between lessons without giving you so much time that you start to forget things.

I would also strongly recommend making a full day of each lesson, even if you only fly for an hour or two. One flight in the morning, a relaxed lunch, and a second flight in the afternoon is probably the most I'd recommend. Over lunch, talk to other people at the club/school - pilots love talking, and you can learn a lot by listening, just make sure you engage your BS-filter! It always seems sad to me when students turn up at the flying school, rush out to the plane, fly for an hour, come back to the club, pay, and immediately drive home. To my mind they've missed the most important part - talking to other pilots and learning (for free) on the ground. I used to spend whole days at the airfield - indeed i still do - helping to pack the hangar, helping the engineers working on planes, talking to other pilots, generally absorbing the whole of aviation.

Most of all, enjoy yourself, and as said by others, take lots of trial lessons at different schools until you find the airfield, the school, the plane and the instructor that "click" for you.
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By Morten
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1529305
HarryBo wrote:
Morten wrote:I think most schools will/can offer you a LAPL if you ask for it.

Didn't know that. Will keep in mind for the schools I left out because of what was stated in their websites


I could be off the mark, but as far as I understand, it is the same instructor qualification and skillset which allows an instructor to teach either, and the same authorisation for the school which allows them to offer the course. (Ditto for the NPPL, I think?)
I think few schools advertise the LAPL because relatively few students do it (2015-2016: 1,650 EASA PPL, 480 CAA NPPL and 280 EASA LAPL...) and it is relatively new.

I have witnessed 2 discussions at my club where a student has walked in and asked about the LAPL and the CFI has said something along the lines of "Yes, we can do that, but..." and after some discussion, the student had changed his mind to the PPL route. I guess some of that is down to the joy in learning (as opposed to getting the licence) and since most students will continue flying after obtaining their licence anyway, you may as well use those same hours to continue flying towards a licence with fewer restrictions.

If you're in West London, you could always pop down to the AOPA centre at Victoria. There is an instructor there every Tuesday and Thursday evening. He does a PPL ground school but he will also be more than happy to give some additional info. (Disclaimer - Adam was my instructor. But don't hold that against him...)

Morten
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By Grelly
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1529313
Hi Harry,

If you could be more specific about your location, we might be able to suggest the best airfield (from a commuting point of view).

A LAPL is a good target in my view. You can always upgrade if you find a need to fly outside Europe or with more than 4 people on board.

I did the concentrated flying approach. I got my PPL in three weeks of intensive flying and studying (about 30 years ago). I certainly don't regret doing so, but gosh it was hard work. And as others have suggested, it did consume my entire flying budget. It was a while before I could afford to fly again.

Good luck and have fun,

Grelly
By Spooky
#1529318
I started off wanting the licence as soon as possible. Weather and more bad weather caused it to stretch on longer than planned!

Don't set a timescale and enjoy the journey. Getting your head in the text books will help a lot too. I regret not doing more reading before I started as principles of flight and meteorology explain a lot on why an aircraft acts/reacts the way it does.
By johnm
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1529322
Much good advice above.

First please note that Leia is lady and jolly competent on the flying and educations fronts as well as good fun when she turns up at events. :D

Reading her piece was a jolly sensible start.

Don't separate training from flying, it's a learning process every time you embark on a flight. Sometimes that will be with an instructor or examiner and sometimes it won't. I only started in my early fifties and I've progressed steadily ever since and have enjoyed the learning more than the flying in many ways.
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By Rob P
#1529323
Grelly wrote:Hi Harry,

If you could be more specific about your location, we might be able to suggest the best airfield (from a commuting point of view).


For instance, if you are N London

http://www.northwealdflighttraining.co. ... periences/

Welcome to the club of poverty-challenged but happy aviators.

Rob P
By HarryBo
#1529410
Cessna57 wrote:Travel to each airfield, buy a log book, log each trial lesson (they all count)


This is a great idea, but how would that work? Do you show your logbook and the instructors just knows what to go through based on your hours?

T67M wrote:I would also strongly recommend making a full day of each lesson, even if you only fly for an hour or two.


I was planning on doing that anyway. Is a long way to the airfield to just stay for an hour :p

Morten wrote:If you're in West London, you could always pop down to the AOPA centre at Victoria. There is an instructor there every Tuesday and Thursday evening. He does a PPL ground school but he will also be more than happy to give some additional info. (Disclaimer - Adam was my instructor. But don't hold that against him...)


I thought most, if not all, schools offer ground lessons as well. Isn't that right?

Grelly wrote:If you could be more specific about your location, we might be able to suggest the best airfield (from a commuting point of view).


I live in Chiswick. I also saw that it might be quick to commute to Redhill, seems like is well connected.

Spooky wrote:I regret not doing more reading before I started as principles of flight and meteorology explain a lot on why an aircraft acts/reacts the way it does.


I thought it might be a good idea to get the books and start studying. Seems like loads of material to cover :shock:
Will see if I can find them used anywhere as they seem to be pretty expensive.

johnm wrote:First please note that Leia is lady and jolly competent on the flying and educations fronts as well as good fun when she turns up at events. :D


I believe I referred to her as "him" indeed. My apologies, didn't realise from the username :p


EDIT: I wanted to ask on my initial post but I completely forgot about it. My ultimate goal is to (at some point) do aerobatics and fly air racers. Is it possible with a LAPL to do so or I would be required to upgrade to ppl at some point?


Thanks :D
Last edited by HarryBo on Tue Apr 11, 2017 6:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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By T67M
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1529415
Redhill is a good option if the train links work for you. You can walk from the station to the airfield, although a taxi is more common as it's quite a long walk. Three fixed wing flying schools operate there, I believe all offering the LAPL in a range of planes from C152 through to Diamond Katana.

Full disclosure: I learned at Redhill and still fly (now as a CRI) with the same club.