The place for technical discussions about GA and flying.
Forum rules: Technical discussions about GA only, please.
#1824672
Hello,

I was checking the UK CAA grant scheme to get an Electronic Conspicuity Device for your aircraft. And I see that PilotAware Rosetta and SkyEcho2 are cover in this grant.

Between these two, I disregarded SkyEcho2 because you cannot leave it connected on the aircraft and you have to either charge it at home or carry power banks with you. So I thought to choose PilotAware because I can install it permanently and leave it connected.

But then I rechecked the table on the UK CAA website: https://www.caa.co.uk/General-aviation/ ... y-devices/
, and it seems to say that PilotAware cannot be seen by anybody except by another PilotAware users. So I do not find it very useful because you can only see but you cannot really be seen. Is that correct?

If so, what's a good alternative that it is still included in the UK CAA grant?
#1824710
What you say is correct, you can only be seen by other PilotAware users. But they are a large majority of EC users. You will see more than a Sky Echo.

However, I don't see why you can't leave Sky Echo connected to the power in the aeroplane and just switch the unit on and off as required. Ok, it might not come on automatically but you'd just need to switch it on. However, you'll only see ADS-B traffic, you won't see any of the PilotAware users unless they also have ADS-B out.
#1824752
You can connect a pilot aware to most Mode-S transponders with the appropriate adapter to get ADS-B out (seen by others).
The GPS signal isn't certified, so can't be used by ATC and the traffic systems of some airliners won't use the data, but the vast majority of people who have a traffic input would see you.

Sky Echo has a USB power socket which can be left plugged in, but it must have visibility of the outside world to work, so you can't hide it behind a panel.
#1824816
I've been looking at this closely, and it's clear that there are four technologies at present:
    Transponders
    PilotAware + ground stations
    SkyEcho
    Flarm

Each will let you be seen by some other aircraft, and to see some other aircraft. None by themselves will achieve near-universal success at both.

In deciding which (if any) to adopt, you need to decide:
    Do you want to be seen by others, so they can avoid you, or see others so you can avoid them? For example, PilotAware + ground stations lets you see the majority of other transmitting traffic, but you will mainly be seen by other PilotAware users
    What kind of traffic is the greatest concern. Over 90% of glider mid-airs are with other gliders, which is why Flarm is top of their list

In the long term we will collectively develop interoperable systems, largely driven by drone traffic in my view, but that is some years away.
#1824822
profchrisreed wrote:In the long term we will collectively develop interoperable systems, largely driven by drone traffic in my view, but that is some years away.


We already have collectively developed interoperable systems. It's called ADS-B. If you transmit ADS-B, then nearly everyone will be able to see you. So transmit ADS-B, please. The easiest answer is a SkyEcho 2. Harder, but better from a visibility point of view, is a fitted Mode S ES transponder hooked up to GPS source. Because then you'll be transmitting with higher power and with external antennae, both of which will reduce your aircraft (and a receiving aircraft) from masking the signal.

Being conspicuous is the first step, because otherwise it'd be like the blind leading the blind. And even if you can't see someone but they can see you, that's sufficient to avoid a collision.

After you can be seen, you might want to improve what you can see, in which case a PilotAware Rosetta makes sense (eg. to see Mode S MLAT and FLARM when within range of a ground station) or alternatively a FLARM subscription for SkyDemon used with a SkyEcho 2 (to see FLARM direct, but no Mode S MLAT).
Charliesixtysix liked this