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#1658522
I'm researching options for a flight to Murcia in southern Spain
so if anyone has any words of wisdom to share, I'm very listening

one option is to make the trip in my AA5
can probably just do it in two hops

the other option is to go up-market and rent a PA32R or C210
again opinions, and indeed locations of anyone who rents such beasts

cheers :)
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By mmcp42
#1658523
have decided to fly LX and not bother renting

proposed route is
Holmbeck - BPK - LAM - SFD - Bordeaux
gnat's over 4 hours

refuel, Ts and Ps

then
Bordeaux - San Sebastian - skirt round Valencia and Alicante - Murcia
gnat's over 4 hours

comments from the committee most welcome :)
By TLRippon
#1658524
Are you VFR or IFR?

You’ll find the west to east transit of the peninsula easier from a GA point of view in France than Spain, entry via Perpignan and East coast past Valencia. Plenty of stop options if you need them.
Don’t forget to take a valid VAT number and corresponding address for Spanish fuel and remember you need an internal flight plan in Spain if you touch CAS including a CTR.
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By mmcp42
#1658525
TLRippon wrote:Are you VFR or IFR?

You’ll find the west to east transit of the peninsula easier from a GA point of view in France than Spain, entry via Perpignan and East coast past Valencia. Plenty of stop options if you need them.
Don’t forget to take a valid VAT number and corresponding address for Spanish fuel and remember you need an internal flight plan in Spain if you touch CAS including a CTR.


I'll be VFR
I looked at going south of the Pyrenees, but wanted to do it in two hops
I think going south just exceeds my (5 hour) leg limit)
but I will take a look - thanks :)

I have VAT details packed already - cheers

I suspected the flight plan rule, but good to hear it from someone else :)
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By GolfHotel
#1658526
Barcelona airspace is not that easy to get through, but they do have VFR routes. So I would route something like you are planning.

I've flown from the med coast to San Sebastion, was given nothing known to affect all the way to Pamplona. It translates from the Spanish as "don't bother me again." :D

If I had 8 hrs to do I would break it into 3 rather than 2 legs.

If you get there late on a hot day expect turbulence, there can be a lot. Flying high can help.

You need to keep an eye on the wind forecast if you stray to the eastern end of the Pyrenees.
By TLRippon
#1658527
Reason I asked about VFR or IFR was that the bit in the middle of Spain is high, averaging about 4000' most of the way with a couple of bits up to 7000' on that route. Not really a problem in it's self but the weather in the centre can be a mixture of Heat-Thermal-CB-TCU-lightning-rain-poor vis, turbulence and low cloud. The alternates are sparse and every time I've gone that way, I have ended up somewhere I wasn't going, mainly looking at fuel reserves, even with 7 hour tanks.
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By mmcp42
#1658528
have looked at the Eastern route
liking it now :)

leg1 Holmbeck - Le Havre
leg2 Le Havre - Carcassone
leg3 Carcassone - Murcia

interestingly most of the route at 8000' avoids lots of airspace complications too!

thanks for everyone's input :)

just need the weather to behave
trip report to follow :)
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By skydriller
#1658529
It may have changed, but it used to be the case a few years ago when I visited Carcassone, that the only way to get fuel was with a BP card...might be worth a call to check if you dont have one - we ended up hopping to Castelnaudry as were headed home the opposite way to yourself - in your case Lezignan would be the right direction for Spain.

Regards, SD..
By welkyboy
#1658530
You have to use the semi circular rules in EASA land now, so VFR is FL35/55/75/95 etc. on tracks 001-180 and Fl45/65/85/105 on tracks 181-360. The French ATCO’s get very agitated when UK pilots insist on flying at IFR levels VFR !
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By mmcp42
#1658531
welkyboy wrote:You have to use the semi circular rules in EASA land now, so VFR is FL35/55/75/95 etc. on tracks 001-180 and Fl45/65/85/105 on tracks 181-360. The French ATCO’s get very agitated when UK pilots insist on flying at IFR levels VFR !


Roger that
8000' is for planning
couple of feet either way is well within limits :)

have now updated all the legs to comply
route(s) still work nicely :)
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By skydriller
#1658532
welkyboy wrote:You have to use the semi circular rules in EASA land now, so VFR is FL35/55/75/95 etc. on tracks 001-180 and Fl45/65/85/105 on tracks 181-360. The French ATCO’s get very agitated when UK pilots insist on flying at IFR levels VFR !


Upset? The French? Hmmm. Last summer returning from the UK I declared I was at FL65 to Poitier info who kept responding 6500ft... "Gallic Shrug Smilie"

Just relax and enjoy flying across France with a proper FIS. :twisted:

Regard, SD..
By TLRippon
#1658533
Carcasonne can be difficult with fuel generally sometimes only selling it to flying club aircraft when they get low in the summer. We tend to use Albi LFCI which is en route. Fuel closes for lunch 1-2pm. It is usually deserted and a quick fuel stop. Friendly ATC and English spoken. Just a small point, I've found recently that Le Havre Customs have been keeping unusual hours. Perhaps Deauville or Caen would be a better bet if the timings don't work out.
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By GrahamB
#1658534
TLRippon wrote:Carcasonne can be difficult with fuel generally sometimes only selling it to flying club aircraft when they get low in the summer. We tend to use Albi LFCI which is en route. Fuel closes for lunch 1-2pm. It is usually deserted and a quick fuel stop. Friendly ATC and English spoken. Just a small point, I've found recently that Le Havre Customs have been keeping unusual hours. Perhaps Deauville or Caen would be a better bet if the timings don't work out.

Caen require 24 hours PPR now, so Le Havre (2 hours PPR) or Deauville (no PPR) remain a better bet.
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By mmcp42
#1658535
TLRippon wrote:Carcasonne can be difficult with fuel generally sometimes only selling it to flying club aircraft when they get low in the summer. We tend to use Albi LFCI which is en route. Fuel closes for lunch 1-2pm. It is usually deserted and a quick fuel stop. Friendly ATC and English spoken. Just a small point, I've found recently that Le Havre Customs have been keeping unusual hours. Perhaps Deauville or Caen would be a better bet if the timings don't work out.


sounds good
plotted it out
how do you manage descending through LFR46C that seems to be a brick wall?
or do you (they) just shrug and press on?!?