[yawningdog]

My response to Guest 1 is, firstly, that no take off should be "marginal". As PIC you have a responsibility to your passengers. If I wouldn't fly with anyone who made marginal decisions.

Secondly, I was the one that filmed that Compton Abbas take off, and only put it one here because it was truly marginal, ie: dancing with death. All of the other aircraft were climbing away long before that one

The Sandown PA28 takeoff looked remarkably similar, but they weren't so lucky.

[Paul_Sengupta]

How marginal is marginal though? Sometimes I'll deliberately keep the plane on the ground for longer to produce less drag to make sure I can get airborne, maybe at Vx. In that case it may look like I use a lot of runway but I didn't *have* to.

[Keef]

Indeed, Paul, but when you do climb away the angle is a lot steeper than the PA28 in that bit of film.

800m is plenty for a PA28 at MTWA in the UK. What happens sometimes is that the PA28 is a few hundred pounds above MTWA. Or the engine is ill and not producing the rated output.

Or it's hot 'n high. Compton Abbas isn't that high.

[ROG]

We have just had a new prop fitted to our PA28---180----amazing improvement in performance which was already very good.
We have had a couple of new members moving up from the pa28-140--it takes sometime before it sinks in that the 180 does not float but can get up and down in a very short distance,

[Rupert S]

We have just had a new prop fitted to our PA28---180----amazing improvement in performance which was already very good.
We have had a couple of new members moving up from the pa28-140--it takes sometime before it sinks in that the 180 does not float but can get up and down in a very short distance,

Try a 236

[Blackprince]

Having operated both a PA28-140 and a 181 they are not good strip aircraft. The leave it to 55 knots and add two stages of flap seems to be the best method of getting a short take off. Recently a 140 went through the hedge at my strip. The take off performance even with one up was very weak.

Even though I prefer Pipers I have bought a continental 300D engined 172 to operate from my strip. And this old girl gets airborne at 53mph indicated with 10 degrees of flap and two thirds loading using 200m.

The Warrior is a no-no for a short strip unless very lightly loaded and the 181 is just a tad better. Strangely enough, the old Hershey bar wing 180 has the best short strip performance of the sub 235hp PA28s; never worked out why, must be the prop. Don't know about the Arrows from experience; but the newer ones always seemd to have a longer take off than their predecessors.

Best short strip aircraft is the 182!

[Gerard Clarke]

We have had a couple of new members moving up from the pa28-140--it takes sometime before it sinks in that the 180 does not float but can get up and down in a very short distance,

Surely the PA 28 140 does not inherently float? People taught by teenage instructors try to land it too fast.

Best short strip aircraft is the 182!

Only if you are selecting from a very narrow field. What about Supercubs, Huskies, Maules, Wilgas etc?

[Keef]

Like m'learned friend said: PA28s don't float if you land 'em at the right speed.

I was never an artist, so I learned "painting by numbers". I fly by numbers, too.

[Gerard Clarke]

Numbers? Always had you down as a Leviticus kinda dude, Padre.

Numbers are of course v good, but you can also do the flying by attitude thing (I don't mean the sort of attitude displayed by the Guests above: "that departure was perfectly safe"). One of my best weekend's flying was spent with a busted ASI . My approaches and landings are rarely as good as they were that weekend. Sometimes I think that we shouldn't be allowed panels for visual flying. OK, altimeters (mainly to avoid busting airspace), wibbly wobbly compasses and basic engine clocks, but nowt else.