Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
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By TopCat
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1907825
Dodo wrote:

> And perhaps I might fly to Popham before that as a dry run for the Bolkow meet.

Very sensible. If you do that, pick a day when they're on 26 or 03. 26 is interesting for its dogleg approach to avoid flying over the petrol station, and 03 is interesting for being downhill, with a wood immediately to the south. They're both perfectly easy but require good speed control.

On 26, extra points for getting off at the first turnoff (more or less at the mid point). The next one is acceptable, but points will be deducted for using the 'exit of shame' right at the far end.
#1907840
TopCat wrote:
>
> On 26, extra points for getting off at the first turnoff (more or less at the mid
> point). The next one is acceptable, but points will be deducted for using the 'exit
> of shame' right at the far end.

I know what you mean, but with that nasty curl over the trees when the wind is southerly, I am quite happy just to get down safely!
Flyin'Dutch' liked this
User avatar
By Paul_Sengupta
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1907851
TopCat wrote:
> On 26, extra points for getting off at the first turnoff (more or less at the mid
> point). The next one is acceptable, but points will be deducted for using the 'exit
> of shame' right at the far end.

I use the exit nearest my parking space! ;-)

Or before if I need fuel.
#1908211
Cub wrote:

> As a general guide, if an event is likely to generate more than 100 movements per
> day, proposals should be discussed with the appropriate Principal Inspector (ATM).

Why?

Countless airfields in the US deal with well over 100 movements every day, nearly all GA of very varied types and speeds.

Is there something special about UK airspace and airfields that means we need lots of yellow-jacket-and-clipboard-types to make lots of work for themselves and issue many pages of rules and procedures before we can cope with an airfield being a bit busy?

My suspicion is that it's deeply cultural in this country. Partly from ex-military attitudes in regulation (prevailing attitude = nothing at all happens without express permission and detailed rules) and partly from aviation attracting busybody types who lap it all up and add their own layers. The number of A/G operators who spend their weekends clogging up the airwaves pointlessly replying to every single position report at airfields up and down the country would appear to bear this out.
#1908212
defcribed wrote:

> Countless airfields in the US deal with well over 100 movements every day, nearly all
> GA of very varied types and speeds.
>
> Is there something special about UK airspace and airfields that means we need lots of
> yellow-jacket-and-clipboard-types to make lots of work for themselves and issue many
> pages of rules and procedures before we can cope with an airfield being a bit busy?
>
> My suspicion is that it's deeply cultural in this country. Partly from ex-military
> attitudes in regulation (prevailing attitude = nothing at all happens without express
> permission and detailed rules) and partly from aviation attracting busybody types
> who lap it all up and add their own layers. The number of A/G operators who spend
> their weekends clogging up the airwaves pointlessly replying to every single position
> report at airfields up and down the country would appear to bear this out.

I think "Taking back Control" sums it up nicely. Which part of that phrase made the British think that there was going to be less control. It reminds me of the public school boys being "Initiated" with a paddle to the backside crying out, "Please sir can I have more". The British love it, want it and can't stop lapping it up.
By TopCat
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1908320
defcribed wrote:

> My suspicion is that it's deeply cultural in this country. Partly from ex-military
> attitudes in regulation (prevailing attitude = nothing at all happens without express
> permission and detailed rules) and partly from aviation attracting busybody types
> who lap it all up and add their own layers. The number of A/G operators who spend
> their weekends clogging up the airwaves pointlessly replying to every single position
> report at airfields up and down the country would appear to bear this out.

I do broadly agree with this.

But I think it's also general sloppiness and poor standards from pilots. Witness the rubbish R/T, the woefully inaccurate position reporting, the huge circuits, the high speed touchdowns that we see day in, day out.

Anyone that's been to the Rally over the years will have heard the muppets turning up on frequency, clearly not having the slightest clue that there's an event on, much less having read the AIC.

If it was a 5 page note on arrivals/departures, and no RA(T), and no "scary scary" messaging to at least partially discourage the faint hearted, I'd hazard a guess that it would be a lot worse.

The poor standards and love of rule-making tend to fuel each other, sadly, as the poorer the standards, the more rules, and the more everything becomes an exercise in box-ticking to prove rule-compliance - I suspect, at the expense of what used to be called airmanship.
Shoestring Flyer liked this
#1908322
I think its mostly piffle.

Not the "100 movements a day discussion with inspector" part, I have no idea whether that's true or not, but the whole comparison with US airfields.

Pretty sure 100+ movements a day is an average summer's day for Popham. At the gliding club we can do 100+ before lunch & we're not even A/G. There are plenty of UK airfields that do 100+ movements a day without intervention from the CAA.

The microlight trade fair at the end of the month at Popham will generate several hundred movements a day. The 2 page pilot briefing notes seem eminently sensible, I can't see any evidence of CAA heavy-handedness.

>It reminds me of the public school boys being "Initiated" with a paddle to the backside crying out, "Please sir can I have more".

The only time I have come across this was the fictional American frat house in the film Animal House, quite why you think this is a British thing baffles me. Do you speak from personal experience or are you merely expressing a prejudice against people who aren't like you?
patowalker liked this
By Highland Park
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1911156
Boxkite wrote:
> Have I missed something? What's the reason for not using Sywell this year?
> Why not Turweston?
> This year would have been the first time I would fly in to Sywell. I won't
> be going anywhere near Popham on this weekend though.
> It's also the same long weekend of the Bournemouth Air Show, not so far
> away....

According to the latest “Hangar Talk” by Steve Slater in the latest copy of Aeroplane, one of the reasons is (and I quote):

“However, Sywell is currently in the process of a transition to a new air-to-ground service and, as part of this, an hourly cap on the number of aircraft movements which can occur has been agreed with the Civil Aviation Authority. Clearly the rally is well over this figure, so the LAA has announced a new event and a new location for the first traditional rally date of the first weekend in September.”

Ian
Boxkite liked this
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