Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
#1911374
BoeingBoy wrote:I do cringe when I read about there being two methods for crosswind landings. ..

(I'm not going to quote the whole post; if needs be, look at it separately)


There is also this fascination with landing down the centre-line of a runway. If there is a wide runway, land at at angle to reduce the crosswind component...10 or 15 degrees to the centre-line will help to reduce the crosswind component significantly.
This doesn't seem to be taught, but has to be self-learned :(
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By PeteSpencer
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#1911376
SGS66 wrote:The PA28 has the rudder and nosewheel connected so one is in danger of dropping the nosewheel down with the wheel pointing a lot off to one side when the cross wind is heavy


In the PA28 Arrow, the steering 'disconnects' once the weight is off the noseleg so it can tuck itself away neatly into the nosewheel well.

Similarly it re-engages on gear extension so crosswind landings are not a problem.

Particularly as I customarily 'crab and kick ' any way.

(Ack that its not really a 'kick', but it sounds good .) :roll:

Wouldn't be surprised if fixed gear PA28s have similar.
Last edited by PeteSpencer on Sat May 14, 2022 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
#1911430
Rob L wrote:
BoeingBoy wrote:I do cringe when I read about there being two methods for crosswind landings. ..

(I'm not going to quote the whole post; if needs be, look at it separately)


There is also this fascination with landing down the centre-line of a runway. If there is a wide runway, land at at angle to reduce the crosswind component...10 or 15 degrees to the centre-line will help to reduce the crosswind component significantly.
This doesn't seem to be taught, but has to be self-learned :(


I have one instructor that says "you've paid for the whole width of the runway so you might as well use it" and another (CPL instructor) who insists on absolute adherence to centreline all the way down. I suspect the first instructor is being humourous when I end up doing a sideways tour of the runway due to the aforementioned reticence to get the wing down sufficiently :shock:
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By PeteSpencer
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#1911438
NDB_hold wrote:Or the second is training you to (eventually) land a 747? Whereas the first remembers that you are doing this for fun…


Not so long ago ISTR Flyer did an article on 'Could a PPL land a 737?'

(or 747-can't remember which..........)
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By GrahamB
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#1911439
NDB_hold wrote:Or the second is training you to (eventually) land a 747? Whereas the first remembers that you are doing this for fun…

If you train someone to land accurately on the centreline, it's the first step in training them to land accurately wherever -they- choose, not just leaving it to fate.
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By TopCat
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#1911579
BoeingBoy wrote:Except it doesn't on most occasions, because we all carry a little more speed on windy days and more often than not the aircraft floats. Now the (kick and miss) leaves the aircraft drifting sideways, so into wind bank is applied to counter and wait for the touchdown.

No it doesn't. If you've got excess speed and you're still flying, it's too early to straighten up.
By TopCat
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#1911629
GrahamB wrote:If you train someone to land accurately on the centreline, it's the first step in training them to land accurately wherever -they- choose, not just leaving it to fate.

Is leaving it to fate a thing?

Why is it a big deal? If you're left of where you want to be, go right. Or vice versa. How does training help that?

How do people land on narrow runways? Or do they only go places with wide ones?
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By GrahamB
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#1911633
TopCat wrote:
GrahamB wrote:If you train someone to land accurately on the centreline, it's the first step in training them to land accurately wherever -they- choose, not just leaving it to fate.

Is leaving it to fate a thing?


Once you start instructing you soon learn that yes, it is, although it’s often just people being sloppy and not caring (or even noticing) that they didn’t touch down where they originally intended.

(I’m making myself a hostage to fortune here, as it will be a forumite who’ll be doing my IR annual PC at some point in the near future :lol: )
By TopCat
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#1911636
GrahamB wrote:(I’m making myself a hostage to fortune here, as it will be a forumite who’ll be doing my IR annual PC at some point in the near future :lol: )

It hasn't escaped my notice that I've been doing the same. It's got to the point where people are now commenting on my landings on the radio. :shock:

Mentioning no names, but the voice I heard was distinctly sinister. :pirat:
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#1911782
In the jets we were encouraged to start applying rudder to straighten the nose at about 200'.


Why? I taught VC10 pilots to 'crab' wings level right up to the flare, then gently yaw to align with the RW at the same rate that they flared. Anyone who 'kicks it straight' deserves a sound kicking themselves!

Same technique in the PA-28 and it always worked a treat no matter what the crosswind.

This 'wing down' business is some American nonsense, in my 10000 hrs opinion....
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By TopCat
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#1911790
nickwilcock wrote:Anyone who 'kicks it straight' deserves a sound kicking themselves!

Why is this? You're not the first one to say this sort of thing, and I don't understand.

With the crab technique, once you're holding off waiting to land, yawing it straight needs to be timed right, and executed promptly. Too late and you land going sideways; too early, and you're drifting off in the crosswind.

So it's not a violent kick, obviously, but I don't see how it can be gradual without an element of slip being introduced to prevent drifting off.

Time it right, there's no need for any wing down, just the application of a little aileron to prevent roll. I presumably do that, but I'm never aware of it.