Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
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By ikcarusflyer
#1889054
Dave W wrote:I've had a partial response from my Home Office Policy contact. It covers my Q3, which was:

Dave W wrote:3. The document states (on page 2): "If you are travelling between GB and another country within the Common Travel Area (NI, Ireland, the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man) and are using a port that is not police designated, you must still notify police at least 12 hours in advance of your journey. Failure to seek approval is a criminal offence under the Terrorism Act 2000." (My bold).
  • Please confirm the requirement for "Approval".

The answer is:
Home Office wrote:Regarding the Terrorism Act 2000 notification requirement, your question (3), you are correct, in the case of aircraft not operating for reward, if the airfield is non-designated, the requirement is to notify the relevant police force, it is not to seek approval.

So that's good. :thumleft:

They go on to say:
Home Office wrote:For (1) and (2), I have shared these with colleagues in HMRC as they own the policy for these particular issues.

I'll report back again when I have something for Qs 1 &2 - likely by the end of this week. I'll eventually be asking if the HMRC letter etc will be re-published with amendments.

Q4 is now resolved as noted earlier, and was about the 18 month extension to the Blanket Interim Certificate of Agreement. Like others, I was impressed at how positively the whole CoAA process has been undertaken since late last year, and told her so:
Dave W wrote:Can I take the opportunity to thank all involved with the interim blanket CoAA process for the proactive and helpful way it has been managed from the outset? I understand from many others at airfields around the UK that they feel the same.

Reply:
Home Office wrote:Finally, thank you for feedback on the CoA process, I have passed your thanks on to the teams involved, it’s always nice to hear about a job well done, so thank you for taking the time to let us know.



WRT the requirement to notify police 12 hours before the flight, it seems to my reading, to nullify the benefit of having a 2hour notification period for customs. 2 hours GAR would permit a "spontaneous" flight to Europe, whereas 12hours police notification alongside it puts us all back in the original position we were in?
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By Dave W
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1891514
I'm still in discussion with HMRC about this, but I suspect (a) they won't budge on the "before departure" change and (b) they will come to regret it from a point of view of increased confusion and official staff effort.

I owe them a response from just before the Christmas break: More if and when there is something to report.
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By skydriller
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1891530
Dave W wrote: I suspect (a) they won't budge on the "before departure" change and (b) they will come to regret it from a point of view of increased confusion and official staff effort.


Totally Agree. A case of those in legislation not understanding the consequences of a small change which they wont admit was an error. We've seen this in aviation before - the Barton Interpretation springs to mind.

Regards, SD..
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By FlightDek
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1891539
My understanding is that the "2 hours before departure" notification is to give UKBF time to assess the GAR and if need be have the aircraft prevented from taking off, rather than just meeting it on arrival
By johnm
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1891542
Presumably this 2 hour window is part of their idiot immigration policies
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By Dave W
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1891560
FlightDek wrote:My understanding is that the "2 hours before departure" notification is to give UKBF time to assess the GAR and if need be have the aircraft prevented from taking off, rather than just meeting it on arrival

That's not been suggested in my comms with them so far, but I'll ask in my response.
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By Rob P
#1891563
johnm wrote:Presumably this 2 hour window is part of their idiot immigration policies


Why are we letting idiots in at all? We have plenty of our own already.

Rob P
Iceman, johnm, kanga and 1 others liked this
By patowalker
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1891610
The minimum PNR for departures from Le Touquet and Calais is 2 hours before departure. This is the shortest period required at French ports of entry without a permanent Customs presence, so only pilots flying from full Customs aiports will be negatively affected by the new GAR requirements. No?
By Ibra
#1891624
Tim need to get us the outbound feature in SkyDemon now :thumleft:

FlightDek wrote:My understanding is that the "2 hours before departure" notification is to give UKBF time to assess the GAR and if need be have the aircraft prevented from taking off, rather than just meeting it on arrival


I think I need to stop watching James Bond movies 8)

That was not required in the past, so why now?

I think the “declaration & notification” of outbound travel is now mandated to cover any temporary import/admission & temporary exports/returns of EU goods & UK goods, especially aircraft itself, it will not take very long before we start talking about C88/VAT for EU-reg based in UK (or G-reg in EU)

Why 2h, who knows? but maybe you are right about the James Bond thing :pirat:
By patowalker
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1891724
Ibra wrote:Tim need to get us the outbound feature in SkyDemon now :thumleft:


It's been there for years, and it is an OnlineGAR feature, so not Tim's department.
By johnm
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1891731
We always had an immigration issue because we never joined Schengen which is why we needed a GAR for EU travel.

We now need to go through BOTH immigration and customs processes in BOTH directions as any goods beyond basic duty free allowances would have to declared and supplied with appropriate paperwork. It's also important to have clear provenance for personal possessions taken out and brought back (in theory at least)
By Ibra
#1891741
patowalker wrote:
Ibra wrote:Tim need to get us the outbound feature in SkyDemon now :thumleft:


It's been there for years, and it is an OnlineGAR feature, so not Tim's department.


Yes it’s via OnlineGAR website plug in and it does both out & return (merci Carl :lol: )

I was talking about the SD warning “outbound GAR needs to be filed” :thumright:

PS: for those who needs to be reminded :wink:
patowalker, A le Ron liked this
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