Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
By patowalker
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1876000
russp wrote:
StratoTramp wrote:No just understanding and trying to find the bit that the "dummies" Skyway Code refers to in the proper docs. It has a 'ref 1' OSR4 which I clicked through for interest - but it doesn't go to the specific part. I don't want to go through all 1500 docs.


It's ORS4 /1496 .. it's a 5 page document that does not define the word 'structure'. Interestingly there is also no reference to "RULES FOR THE PROTECTION OF THIRD PARTIES'

https://publicapps.caa.co.uk/docs/33/ORS4%20No.1496.pdf


Ahh, but it is an exception to
CHAPTER 1
Protection of persons and property

SERA.3101 Negligent or reckless operation of aircraft
An aircraft shall not be operated in a negligent or reckless manner so as to endanger life or property of others.
SERA.3105 Minimum heights
Except when necessary for take-off or landing, or except by permission from the competent authority, aircraft shall not be flown over the congested areas of cities, towns or settlements or over an open-air assembly of persons, unless at such a height as will permit, in the event of an emergency arising, a landing to be made without undue hazard to persons or property on the surface. The minimum heights for VFR flights shall be those specified in SERA.5005(f) and minimum levels for IFR flights shall be those specified in SERA.5015(b).
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By russp
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1876012
patowalker wrote:
russp wrote:
StratoTramp wrote:No just understanding and trying to find the bit that the "dummies" Skyway Code refers to in the proper docs. It has a 'ref 1' OSR4 which I clicked through for interest - but it doesn't go to the specific part. I don't want to go through all 1500 docs.


It's ORS4 /1496 .. it's a 5 page document that does not define the word 'structure'. Interestingly there is also no reference to "RULES FOR THE PROTECTION OF THIRD PARTIES'

https://publicapps.caa.co.uk/docs/33/ORS4%20No.1496.pdf


Ahh, but it is an exception to
CHAPTER 1
Protection of persons and property

SERA.3101 Negligent or reckless operation of aircraft
An aircraft shall not be operated in a negligent or reckless manner so as to endanger life or property of others.
SERA.3105 Minimum heights
Except when necessary for take-off or landing, or except by permission from the competent authority, aircraft shall not be flown over the congested areas of cities, towns or settlements or over an open-air assembly of persons, unless at such a height as will permit, in the event of an emergency arising, a landing to be made without undue hazard to persons or property on the surface. The minimum heights for VFR flights shall be those specified in SERA.5005(f) and minimum levels for IFR flights shall be those specified in SERA.5015(b).


Thanks - should have spotted that !
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By Paul_Sengupta
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1876019
A4 Pacific wrote:“Grey is good.”

Right up until the moment you’re standing in a court of law to test your own particular subjective interpretation of it.


It doesn't need to go that far. Post what you want to do on the forum here before doing it and we'll all give you a whole spectrum of replies from "go for it" to "it's illegal" to "it's legal but you'll be bringing GA into disrepute and it'll end up shutting us all down" and you can weigh up the replies to make a decision on whether to do it or not.

It's a shame we can't do polls any more.
#1876023
StratoTramp wrote:
Ibra wrote:The white cliffs are not structure, the car road along them is a structure :thumleft:


See that's interesting, I would have never considered a road a structure. So maybe I have learned something this evening :thumleft:



We have a few roads and tracks crossing the moors around here. None of them have a vertical extent.
Any vehicles on them can be seen from a distance and easily avoided. A gaggle of parked Range Rovers serves as a warning to give the butts a wide berth during the shooting season. :)

We recently lost our biggest obstacle.

Last edited by Joe Dell on Tue Oct 12, 2021 11:44 am, edited 2 times in total.
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By Paul_Sengupta
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1876035
A4 Pacific wrote:“My actions were informed by the advice I sought from the Flyer Forum M’lud!”


Isn't there something in law about being tried by a jury of one's peers?

Ibra wrote:Just scroll social media posts the evening after the flight: search = “small aircraft flying low” & date = today, if it’s not a Bulldog the case is closed :wink:


I don't like low. Especially landing. ;-)
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#1876037
rogerb wrote:All of which makes me wonder what makes "drones" etc safe below 500ft ?


Good point, but aside from the heavy gear (specific approval NOTAM), they are rarely flown 500ft away from “the human operator”? they need line of sight?

I saw one guy holding something in his hand the middle of a plain, I bet he was a “form or some sort of a pilot” :D
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By Cookie
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1876083
From my days at the Belgrano, ISTR it was deemed to be anything with 'vertical extent'.


Many years ago, I recall attending a talk at White Waltham by a CAA lawyer who used exactly that terminology when discussing what was, at the time, Rule 5.

Cookie
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By Milty
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1876152
TheFarmer wrote:
you are more likely to have an issue with a farmer leaning on it, rather than any complaint from the gate itself. And unless he is @thefarmer, then I suspect he’s not going to know what 500ft would look like.


500 feet is easy to guess. It’s when the writing on the motorway or dual carriageway road signs becomes blurry. As soon as it does, you’re too high.

By the way, we don’t lean on gates. It’s a myth. We lean on pub bars, AGA’s, and the edge of the stage at Spearmint Rhinos. :viking:


Apologies for the poor stereotype @TheFarmer. I concur from those that I know in the farming profession whom I’ve spent time with that you are 100% correct unless Mrs M is lurking in this forum in which case I have no idea what Spearmint Rhinos is. I can only assume it’s a brand of extra strong mint from South Africa but are they so big that you can lean on them?