[NDB_hold]

IANAL but… I seem to recall there is a distinction between:

G-ABCD stand by (two way radio communication established)
And
Station calling, stand by (two way radio communication not established)

And that 2-way comms were a requirement for ATZ entry.

Did I imagine all that?

[James Chan]

That differentiation is for Class C or D airspace entry in the USA.

There is something similar for RMZ in the UK / EASA-land BUT there's a key difference. Even if an ATSU replies with "(callsign) stand-by", then entry has NOT been approved: https://publicapps.caa.co.uk/docs/33/20 ... AndTMZ.pdf

[russp]

Position and height to be notified when entering and leaving the zone. (Often not possible on a busy frequency, e.g. a fly in.)

Do all of those resident gliders do that ?

Iceman

Does anyone anywhere?

Given that it's a requirement in Black and White in the UK rules of the air 2015 we all should!

[Ibra]

It’s the first time I heard one needs to report height on entering/leaving non-ATC ATZ? maybe one of these things you hear more on pilot forums than in real frequency? I have not flown that much this year in UK, so I probably missed this but I don’t recall ever hearing someone doing it in the last years neither…

One can’t stop learning, just few weeks I discovered one needs to nominate someone to “trigger SAR” when landing in non-ATC airports

[Dave W]

One can’t stop learning, just few weeks I discovered one needs to nominate someone to “trigger SAR” when landing in non-ATC airports

New to me, too, that one.

Might it be a misunderstandung of the (UK only, I think) need to have a " responsible person" initiate overdue action if you fail to close a Flight Plan?

At an "ATC airport" that is transparent to you, since the responsible person is the ATCO and you've probably not conciously nominated them.

At e.g. a farm strip, it's on you.

But it's a Flight Plan thing; not any old VFR bimble.

[NigelC]

Some years ago I had to stop the launch of a glider when a C152 from a local aerodrome overflew the launch point at about 500ft and carried out a practice forced landing and go around to the adjacent field.
The club sent samples of the steel launch cable to all the local airfields and clubs which seemed to stop a repeat.
The subsequent replacement of the steel cable with much lighter nylon rope increased launch heights from about 1000' to about 1300' from a 900 m strip.

[Ibra]

One can’t stop learning, just few weeks I discovered one needs to nominate someone to “trigger SAR” when landing in non-ATC airports

New to me, too, that one.

Might it be a misunderstandung of the (UK only, I think) need to have a " responsible person" initiate overdue action if you fail to close a Flight Plan?

At an "ATC airport" that is transparent to you, since the responsible person is the ATCO and you've probably not conciously nominated them.

At e.g. a farm strip, it's on you.

But it's a Flight Plan thing; not any old VFR bimble.

Yes I was referring to non closed FPLs which I suppose applies to AG/FISO ADs as well? not just farm strips…

[Dave W]

Yes, it does.

Hence my careful use of "e.g."

My clarification was because your post didn't reference specifically flight planned flights - it implied any flight landing at a "non-ATC airport".

[Ibra]

Yes, it does.

Hence my careful use of "e.g."

My clarification was because your post didn't reference specifically flight planned flights - it implied any flight landing at a "non-ATC airport".

Yes my understanding only for flights on active FPL in the system

On “conscious nomination of ATS” I recently heard that someone called an AG airport for PPR but they did not show up on ETA+X, that was enough to trigger SAR, I am not well versed on AG/FISO airfields procedures or roles & responsibilities but it seems a PPR requests also counts like an active FPL for SAR purpose (at least what the savvy 90% of PPL or ATCO who post on FB seems to think?), does “pass your message on RT” count as FPL?

In any case, the AG/FISO procedures in licensed CAA aerodromes with ATZ are so twisted that one can’t claim they understand all of it, it’s more than just the Class G near my private farm strip or own backyard and I can do what I want

I can talk about uncontrolled IFR inside AG/AFIS ATZ in Golf, but I better shut up

[Charliesixtysix]

Position and height to be notified when entering and leaving the zone. (Often not possible on a busy frequency, e.g. a fly in.)

Do all of those resident gliders do that ?

Iceman

Good question, well presented.

[Rob P]

I recently heard that someone called an AG airport for PPR but they did not show up on ETA+X, that was enough to trigger SAR,

I have actually seen this written on a minor airfield (A/G I think) website.

A note saying that if you didn't turn up they would initiate overdue action.

Arrant nonsense. What overdue action? I haven't outlined a proposed route, my eta is generally "lunchtime" or "late afternoon", never anything more specific as I am quite likely to get distracted and deviate en route to look at something interesting.

Creeping 'flightplans' are something that needs stamping on, hard.

Of course if overdue action is a call to your mobile, which is probably the extent of it, at least there isn't the threat of being invoiced for the operating costs of a big white and red helicopter.

Rob P

[pullup]

The simple answer is to have the courtesy to phone again and cancel your PPR.

[Rob P]

Which, of course I would always do, but if PPR wasn't bad enough, creating an unofficial flight plan requirement to effectively allowing issuing airborne clearances to be added to the job description for A/G operators... What's next?

Rob P

[Ibra]

The simple answer is to have the courtesy to phone again and cancel your PPR.

The simple question is there an Alterting Service associated with PPR to an AG airfields? who gives it and under what conditions?

I understand that AG can't give Basic Service, only FISO & ATC can do this and it includes SAR provisions which everybody (hopefully) understands, but since when AG can provide BS or AS on the baiss of a PPR phone call?

It's good for a PIC to know which "ATS service" they are on, does PPR include an alerting service? does ATZ entry with AG count as control service? is GPS IAP with FISO is procedural service or basic service?

You can't do this as half jobs it's just unhealthy...

[James Chan]

AG does not provide an Alerting Service. Equally there is no mandate to for you to be reported missing if you don't show up after PPR.

Some aerodromes /may/ report you missing as a service to its customers, but others don't as many cancel their flight and don't tell anyone. Equally I don't know anyone will just sit on their backsides if your radio suddenly goes dark.

A FISO can only offer a Basic Service which includes alerting, AFAIK.