Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
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#1867166
I have been flying light GA and gliders whenever the opportunity arose since I went solo in 1967. When I had a share in a Beagle Pup I took my three teenage sons (now grown up with their own families) and my wife flying. They enjoyed their trips down to Sandown but have no enthusiasm for flying, so flying with the family doesn't feature. I am content to accept the risks of flying light aircraft, however when I started collecting my pension I thought through the risks involved with increasing age. I decided that, after 70, I would not fly with a passenger who was not able to take control if I were to become incapacitated. As the vast majority of my flying is single seat that isn't a significant problem.
I maintain my class 2 medical and have no medical problems so I hope I can keep flying until I'm 80 or beyond. My backstop is that I have close friends, all instructors in gliding or SEP, who I fly with occasionally. If the time comes when one of them takes me to one side and tells me his opinion that I shouldn't continue - then I will close my logbook.
And go and buy a boat :lol:
I made 70 this year and I don't regret my decision but am 'extremely vexed' that COVID took away the last two years, potentially 20% of my remaining flying :evil:

IC
Flyin'Dutch', T6Harvard, PeteSpencer and 2 others liked this
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By VRB_20kt
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1867182
Paul_Sengupta wrote:
What if you only fly on CAVOK days when the temperature and dewpoint are far apart?

(ok, there's an issue with degrading skills and confidence but let's disregard that for the time being)


I think you make a very good point. Currency is so important to competence when it comes to flying. If you live in the UK you more or less have to fly in less-than-perfect conditions if your skills are to remain honed.
#1867193
I have taken my wife flying, and more recently my eldest son (age 7) and will doubtless take wife and both sons once the youngest is a bit older. I've also taken my brother, parents, father and brother in law.
Personally, I don't really worry about the wings falling off or the engine failing - the wings almost certainly won't fall off. The engine is a bit more likely to fail, but I've landed gliders in fields and practice glide approaches every now and then so unless over water or Snowdonia I would like to think we'd all live to tell that tale.

What frightens me is a mid-air. I know it's a big sky, but sometimes it's quite a busy big sky with large parts of it closed off to Class A or Class D (I know you can ask for a transit but a lot of the time a lot of us take the easy option and skirt round it).
So there I am yesterday, flying back from Bembridge with the 7 year old heading north in the gap between Southend and Stansted with the Class A ceiling above. He spots another aircraft in our 9 o'clock, about 100 feet above and a mile away, similar heading, we were faster so it fell behind. Then there was a thermalling glider at similar level. No sooner had we passed that than there as more traffic passing right left and then left right at similar level. The latter maneouvering so I watched for a few seconds to make sure he wasn't about to cross in front again.
Eyes forward "JESUS!" PA28 dead ahead, same level, reciprocal course, just starting to "bloom" in the windscreen. Chopped the power, broke right and he broke to his right a second or so later. Passed within a hundred feet or so of each other.
Closest I've ever come to a mid-air for about 20 years (the previous time was ridge-bashing at Portmoak with about 35 other gliders). If we had hit, well I'm pretty certain that would have been 20 seconds of panic and horror and nothing I could do about it. And engine failure would be exciting but there's a lot you can do to make sure it's a story to tell the grandkids and nothing more tragic.

My take away - at that point I was beyond the lowest part of the Class A ceiling so could and should have climbed higher to get out of the 2,000'-ish band a lot of people fly in. Also I had become a little fixated on some traffic and neglected the general lookout for a few seconds.

Another reason to do the IR (and in the morning on the way down it was horribly claggy above the Kent Weald - I spent a lot of time thinking (it would be nice to punch above this).
#1867199
VRB_20kt wrote:
Paul_Sengupta wrote:
What if you only fly on CAVOK days when the temperature and dewpoint are far apart?

(ok, there's an issue with degrading skills and confidence but let's disregard that for the time being)


I think you make a very good point. Currency is so important to competence when it comes to flying. If you live in the UK you more or less have to fly in less-than-perfect conditions if your skills are to remain honed.


Therein lies the rub. If you don't fly in less-than-perfect conditions, then you have no opportunities to hone your less-than-perfect-condition flying skills. So, when you encounter those less-than-perfect situations, you will be (perhaps) less safe as a result.

Theoretically, I imagine there is some sort of bell curve distribution where competency improves proportionate to the time spent in less-than-perfect conditions, up to a point where it drops off and becomes disadvantageous or just dangerous.
#1867204
Paul_Sengupta wrote:What if you, yourself, on your own, fly in all sorts of weather, but only take your family flying on nice days...?


Interestingly, I wonder if the statistics suggest you are more or less likely to be an involved in an accident when carrying a passenger (distractions etc vs having an extra lookout) - my assumption would be 'more likely', but just a guess!
T6Harvard liked this
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By Corsican
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1867628
What an interesting and topical thread. Wife and daughter have no interest in flying, but my 9 year old son is very keen, so he and I have flown a number of flights in my shared tailwheel. I grew up in California and had asked my father for a trial flight for my 13th birthday - we moved to Japan a month before and there is no GA there, so I want to give my son the opportunity I missed given his interest.

I enjoy flying with him, but to one of the earlier points, it was initially somewhat distracting. However, we have gradually worked out some rules as he could be somewhat random (what happens if someone tries to shoot us down? do we have flares or chaff? is that a unicorn? (it actually was a unicorn balloon at 1900 feet) etc etc etc etc... ).

We have a passenger safety brief (don't want to make it too formal, but still want to make sure he is paying attention and understand that it is not a playground ride) before every flight. We talk through what to do or what might happen in different circumstances. Notwithstanding, I periodically have some nerves before flying with him and think through whether or not to go with him. I accept the risk for myself, but he is too young to understand the risks; an innocent. I try to mitigate the risks as we all do, prepare, check, take my time. I cancelled a flight with him as we got to the airfield as I felt a little strange (turns out I was coming down with a stonking cold) and we talked through why I made that decision. He was disappointed, but just trying to get him to think about these things.

Not that I know much about horses where young riders need to muck out the stables, but I try to involve him in some of the non-flying activities like washing the aircraft (which he seems surprisingly keen on), squaring things away after flight (which has not translated to his lego getting squared away in his room sadly).

All in all, even though my responsibility for a passenger is the same whoever they are, it is still my son, so there is an added responsibility. I had seen the "No greater burden" floatplane video some years ago which really had me dwelling at the time and I held off from taking him up.

However, now, I am more comfortable with the decision to take him up from time to time. We get to spend time together, I really think through the risk assessment, we visit airfields and have new experiences for him to talk about: Stow Marie, he loves the flight sims at the Sandown museum, Duxford, Old Warden, Goodwood when a Harvard overtook us and another time when he called out "Spitfire at 4, no 3, no 2 o'clock", seeing the world at x thousand feet. Perhaps the best was when we were about to start and he sharply said "MAGS-Both!" as I wondered why nothing was happening - a bit of a cross between the distraction and the learning for each of us. He reminds me of that every time we fly together now... :)

[edit- clarify a vague sentence]
ChampChump, kanga, patowalker and 6 others liked this
#1867648
Corsican wrote:...., we visit airfields and have new experiences for him to talk about: Stow Marie, he loves the flight sims at the Sandown museum, Duxford, Old Warden, Goodwood ..


hope you bring him to JAM soon .. :)
NDB_hold liked this
By TopCat
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1867687
Corsican wrote:I cancelled a flight with him as we got to the airfield as I felt a little strange (turns out I was coming down with a stonking cold)

Excellent judgement.
I try to involve him in some of the non-flying activities like washing the aircraft (which he seems surprisingly keen on)

All is good here.
Corsican, kanga liked this
#1867690
Paul_Sengupta wrote:What if you, yourself, on your own, fly in all sorts of weather, but only take your family flying on nice days...?


What is the point of flying with family if destination has rubbish weather? or if you can’t see beautiful views in cruise? or have the option to just stop halfway? the best flights that leave a good impression are those where I took family in miserable low cloud days on departure to sunny places along the route and on arrival :thumleft:

If one wants to do weather flying they better get along with another pilot who enjoys that kind flying, the kind who is happy to sleep on the same bed for a night in a hotel eating junk food as the flight is likely to end up in the wrong airport :lol:
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