Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
By Bathman
#1862150
My IMC application has been rejected as the CAA need certified copies of my logbook to add an IMC rating. Every single entry has been signed by the instructor that did the training and the examiner has signed it also.

Is this an example of “gold plating”
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By Rob P
#1862151
My grandfather rights to an aeros endorsement were lost as I hadn't written the word 'aerobatics' in the comment section of my logbook against numerous 20 minute Yak flights.

I offered to do it on the spot, they didn't feel that was appropriate.

Rob P
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By MichaelP
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1862163
You need an approved signature on the photocopy to say that it is a true copy of your logbook.
Since signatures in the logbook are being copied, someone else has to compare the photocopy with the actual logbook...
I had to do this for the CAA and for the CAAT. It’s a common requirement.

For the CAAT it was my signature, for the CAA you’ll need someone like the CFI of an ATO.

For my CRI I refused to send the CAA my nine logbooks, instead I sent representative pages... A lot of signatures were required!
By GAFlyer4Fun
#1862190
Rob P wrote:My grandfather rights to an aeros endorsement were lost as I hadn't written the word 'aerobatics' in the comment section of my logbook ...


I was advised to write "aerobatics" in the comment column for every aeros flight doing the course a few years ago.

I have been in two minds whether to do it since as an indicator of aeros currency in case of future licencing changes/malarky or if joining an aeros group.
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By T67M
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1862237
I use logbook.aero where I've configured extra columns for aerobatics, actual instrument, simulated instrument, instructing etc. Signatures are rare but when needed they are the printout from logbook aero, signed, and then attached as a photograph to the relevant entry.
By Bathman
#1862238
MichaelP wrote:You need an approved signature on the photocopy to say that it is a true copy of your logbook.


Which is then going to be scanned and emailed to the CAA. So what's gained?

The IMC rating was done in my own aircraft with an indipendent instructor. No flying school involvement at all.

And now I have to go to a flying school who have never seen me before. Who will certify my logbooks that they have never seen before.

I can see no purpose to this. It's surely gold plating.
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By MichaelP
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1862276
In Canada ratings are applied for on one simple form, signed by the applicant, and by the instructor/examiner.
Photocopies of the logbook entries, self certified, suffice.
Or the Pilot Training Record is sent.
The fee has to be paid online and the receipt number or a print of the receipt is sent.

An Approved Person, such as wot I were once 8) signs off the rating in your licence booklet, and you have that rating for ninety days within which TC should issue a sticker with the new rating to be stuck in your licence booklet.

For the CRI I had to send certified copies of my licences to the CAA... Transport Canada has this information stored on a device known as a computer database and does not need reassurance in this way.
Why does the CAA have an anti trees, modern systems policy?
Yes, anti ecology and modern methods gold plating to an extent, but UK was a part of the EU...

I flew in England 1973 to 1991, and briefly between times.
What I have come back to is astonishing and a huge shock to my system.

I do the certified true copies business for my Thai validations, and I accept it.
But there has been nothing more onerous and full of hassle and delay than the CASA (Australia) system... Hundreds of dollars wasted for nothing there!
I did get an ASIC to hang myself with if I decided it was all too much... Never got the Validation, this was to be issued after I left... They offered to date it from when I applied for it, two months or so before!

So be frustrated with the CAA, know it would be easier with the CAAT, and much worse with down under CASA.
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By BobM
#1862288
I am having the same issue. I have applied for a CRI, the head of the ATO certified my log book, I'm an ATPL holder so by definition have the required hours, I supplied them with a scan of my log book from 1978 certified as correct by the CAA when I applied for my CPL.. (to prove my SEP hours along with the ones from the ATO )
They a still asking for either my original log book or a certified copy :roll:
I'm not sending 7 log books covering 45 years flying by post so will either go down to LGW or have to speak to some one more senior!
Sadly the system is broken, the folks in the "Shared Service Center" are box tickers and I suspect dont really understand what they are doing, and the few people left in the FCL department are working flat out to try and untangle the mess that everyone is in.
I have colleagues unable to work because of licence issues and PPL holders who months after sending the documents in still havent recieved their licence.
Time of an article @Ian ?
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By Genghis the Engineer
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1862293
This has been the requirement for a long time - I've had CAA ask for certified copies of the same pages of my logbook three times in the space of a year, containing exactly the same information.

It is, as succinctly said above b0!!ox, but it's not new.

G
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By PaulSS
#1862296
I need to change the address on my licences. I'm going to do one at a time because last time they shredded my ATPL and it took nearly a year to get a copy re-issued :roll: To change the address I have to get a certified copy of my revalidation page (the one that's signed by the CAA) and, in their words, they'd prefer a copy of my passport over my driving licence. Guess which one has an address on it! Sest la vee, as they say in pure French :D

I agree with Michael that breaking into the Oz system is a pain in the area and, in particular, the stupid ASIC palaver but once you're in they are far more user-friendly than the CAA. To effect the same change of address involved me logging into the CASA self-help portal and changing my address. Job done in one minute.......all with no certified copies of documents they already hold (because they issued it) and other docs that just prove I'm me and not where I live.

The CAA really are a complete shambles and get worse year by year as they cut more services. Perhaps less spent on their canteen would give more to do the things they're meant to.
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By Lefty
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1862304
I’ve designed and built numerous IT systems for large public sector organisations. Most of them because someone in the higher echelons decided that they could reduce their headcount (= save money) by consolidating similar back office functions into shared service centres.

One such Government department had 7 subsidiary Departments - each employing approximately 25,000 staff. Five of these “Departments” (125,000 staff) had for years, been using SAP software - and were very happy with it, one was a long time ORACLE user, and the 7th had just started to build an ORACLE system. Through some strange Procurement process, the decision was taken to move all 7 subsidiaries onto the latest ORACLE software - at a cost of hundreds of millions.

However the IT teams don’t know the intimate details of the business and have to depend on the existing staff to document their business processes. These are the same staff who know that their jobs would be at risk if the new system needs fewer people to run the business. Ergo, they protect their jobs by documenting the most convoluted and labour intensive process they can devise.

I could be way off the mark, but the CAA’s processes that require multiple submissions (and re-submissions) of documents - which all have to examined and verified by hand (since computers can’t read handwritten docs) - does seem to require more and more employees and managers.
Specifying and purchasing really Carp IT systems that don’t work - seems to be completely in line with my experiences described above. There just is no incentive, and insufficient management skills, to ensure that the job gets done properly.
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