Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
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By Full Metal Jackass
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1860462
Shoestring Flyer wrote:This Flightplan requirement for Cardiff VFR transits is the thin end of the wedge and where they are leading I can forsee others following! :evil:


I'm only surprised that it's Cardiff leading the way, they were always much more helpful than Tumbleweed International across the Severn Channel..... :(
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By James Chan
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1860466
Well if a flight plan meant I’d have better access to airspace, less frequency congestion, better access to ATS, less freecalling, less squawk code changes, and less time/fuel wasted for my flight, then that’s a good thing.

But I wouldn’t want VFR plans mandated that’s for sure.

This is just a NOTAM so hopefully would all be resolved by the end of the pingdemic.
rdfb liked this
#1860489
Coming back to Activating Flight plans at Uncontrolled Aerodromes......
I have experienced (as I am sure others have too) filing an FP and departing, only to find that London Info cant see it :(
Are we saying that the AFPEx Helpline 01489 612792 number is a good number to phone immediately before departure to make sure that they have it ?
#1860496
simoon wrote:Coming back to Activating Flight plans at Uncontrolled Aerodromes......
I have experienced (as I am sure others have too) filing an FP and departing, only to find that London Info cant see it :(
Are we saying that the AFPEx Helpline 01489 612792 number is a good number to phone immediately before departure to make sure that they have it ?



Check UK AIP GEN3.3 Air Traffic Services there are all phone numbers for London/Scottish FIS & ATC :thumleft:
It’s 01489-611970 they will confirm if they have or not
#1860499
Ibra wrote:
pullup wrote: Departure messages are not required for IFR flights inside controlled airspace, unless the flight is leaving European airspace. Unlikely.

Not to be confused with getting your Airways joining instructions.


Not much of use then except for EGBT to KJFK !


What I meant is a Dep message is not required if the flight is to be conducted in CAS in Europe. If you are leaving Europe then a Dep message is required.
#1860514
pullup wrote:
Ibra wrote:
pullup wrote: Departure messages are not required for IFR flights inside controlled airspace, unless the flight is leaving European airspace. Unlikely.

Not to be confused with getting your Airways joining instructions.


Not much of use then except for EGBT to KJFK !


What I meant is a Dep message is not required if the flight is to be conducted in CAS in Europe. If you are leaving Europe then a Dep message is required.



Got it for leaving Europe but for Europe flight in CAS what does that mean? a bit of examples,
- Going Bembridge to Sandown IFR at 3000ft needs DEP message? (Yes or No, I guess no body cares :lol: )
- Going Sandown to Cherbourg IFR at 6000ft needs DEP message? (I am sure Deauville ATC cares)
- Going Cardiff to Cherbourg airways IFR initially will not need DEP as tower ATC will handle it? or it has to be fully in CAS, say FL120?
#1860517
I’m torn here. On the one hand RisePilot’s suggestion has merit. On the other, a standardised system (to the extent we have standardisation) appeals too. My immediate reaction is that if we are unfortunate enough to see a proliferation of the sort of procedures Cardiff has decided it needs to put in place, I don’t want everyone coming up with their own solution.

Whilst not great and, like others, I question how to submit an abbreviated FPL (as defined) electronically, at least Cardiff is trying to work within the existing infrastructure.

Of course bitter pill swallowing may have been a little easier had the powers that be not sought effectively to monetise access to AFPEX.
rdfb, WalesFlyer50 liked this
#1860526
Sorry. Misunderstood. When you mentioned Cardiff implementing a web-based app, I hadn’t appreciated you meant something that is already fully developed, sits within the extant infrastructure and is ready to go - “oven ready” in today’s political speak.

Rather begs the question though, if this system already exists and has advantages over filing FPLs, why isn’t Cardiff using it?
#1860538
Because the CAA paid for it not Cardiff Ltd ..... a naive question.

Biggin has such a web app. Given the ease of filing FPS through SD etc, I’m slowing coming to the view that FPS maybe the lesser of two evils as
1) it’s an international standard
2) if could be used to kill off the PNR (aka PPR) nonsense we have in the U.K.
3) could it not be addressed to enroute LARS units to get closer to a “proper” “joined up” system?
rdfb, kanga liked this
#1860539
RisePilot wrote:If Cardiff wants the information in an electronic format, it would be easier for one of their work-shy colleagues to implement a simple web-based app to enter info. Requiring a full VFR flight plan just causes problems and more work for others.


Which work shy individuals did you have in mind?
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