[matthew_w100]

A friend has just spent two hours at Sleap trying to find somewhere to go to continue his Northern Tour. Nobody within 90 minutes flying would answer the phone. One of his less enjoyable flying experiences, he confided.

[Dave W]

Hopefully "just" doesn't mean at the time of your post, otherwise I can't say I'm too surprised that nobody is answering the phone between 0530 and 0730!

[Rob P]

... nobody is answering the phone between 0530 and 0730!

Pah! What a way to run a business.

Rob P

[rdfb]

Hopefully "just" doesn't mean at the time of your post, otherwise I can't say I'm too surprised that nobody is answering the phone between 0530 and 0730!

You laugh, but it's still ridiculous that I can't realistically do an 8am departure for, say, a 90 minute flight because I can't get PPR anywhere. Unless maybe I got PPR at 1700 the previous day, but then there's the whole weather dependency problem again.

[Dave W]

I'm not laughing - I am pointing out that that it would be unreasonable to complain about unanswered phones if you call well outside the hours of operation of a business (and FTAOD I don't know if this is what happened - it's only the way it was written).

@rdfb Your observation is a factor of requiring PPR in the first place; and is part of the reason some of us don't like it for airfield whose purpose is to attract visitors (ie not private invitation-only strips).

The answer is simple but inconvenient - apply the previous day, and be prepared to cancel if the weather does intervene.

A school of thought says you might then choose not to advise the PPR field that you're not coming, on the basis that all you did was request permission - not make a booking.

I'd say that's fine, albeit perhaps mildly impolite, given that the airfield is not your keeper.

[muffin]

I recently visited a well known and popular airfield who have always had slight delusions of grandeur. I rang for PPR with an ETA of 1200. the weather took a while to clear with the result that I did not arrive until 1400. I had been there for about half an hour when my phone rang with a call from the tower who asked why I had not arrived yet?
Ignoring the fact that they obviously did not communicate with each other, I have never been chased for supposed non arrival before.

[matthew_w100]

Hopefully "just" doesn't mean at the time of your post, otherwise I can't say I'm too surprised that nobody is answering the phone between 0530 and 0730!

For the avoidance of doubt, the phoning was 10:00 - 12:00 am last Sunday, in the aftermath of the Pistons and Props flyin at Sleap. In the context of the timescales of this thread I thought "just" was legitimate. In any case, he had TOLD me about it yesterday evening, for which "just" is even more reasonable.

[matthew_w100]

I recently visited a well known and popular airfield who have always had slight delusions of grandeur. I rang for PPR with an ETA of 1200. the weather took a while to clear with the result that I did not arrive until 1400. I had been there for about half an hour when my phone rang with a call from the tower who asked why I had not arrived yet?
Ignoring the fact that they obviously did not communicate with each other, I have never been chased for supposed non arrival before.

That sounds like Shobdon. They once initiated overdue action on me, after my revised ETA hadn't made it from their phone reception to their FISO. Who was, I might say, quite frosty with me when I arrived.

It's a great airfield in spite of that

[Dave W]

In any case, he had TOLD me about it yesterday evening, for which "just" is even more reasonable.

Well... you actually used the form of words "...he had just..." in the context of the action - not the later talking to you. So I'd suggest a less reasonable interpretation!

Nevertheless, you'll see above (twice) that I did caveat my interpretation of what was written on the likelihood that your friend wouldn't have been ringing for PPR at 5am.

Regardless, I do agree that publishing a requirement for PPR and then failing to answer the phone well in normal hours makes a mockery of the requirement and - of more direct importance to the airfield - loses them business. Given the 18 months we've just had, one would think that's an important consideration.

Not to say that "PPR" means different things to different airfields, which is another bugbear.

[matthew_w100]

I always like to stretch language

He was well annoyed. But he ended up going up to Kirkbride for a superb Sunday lunch in the adjacent pub and then on to Fishburn to camp the night which was lovely. So he was very happy in the end.

[Rob P]

That sounds like Shobdon. They once initiated overdue action...

For crying out loud! It's permission, not an effing flight plan.

More blurring of the lines at the whim of some unknown functionary.

Rob P

[skydriller]

For crying out loud! It's permission, not an effing flight plan.

Which if in the UK, if you had filed one still wouldnt result in anyone doing anything...

[muffin]

It was indeed Shobdon and it is still one of my favourite destinations.

[matthew_w100]

That sounds like Shobdon. They once initiated overdue action...

For crying out loud! It's permission, not an effing flight plan.

More blurring of the lines at the whim of some unknown functionary.

Rob P

Yup. But with the best of intentions.

I'd planned (and PPRed) Redhill - Shobdon - Halton - Redhill. But I actually swapped Halton and Shobdon, ringing Shobdon to tell them I'd be three hours later than originally guessed. Unfortunately the message didn't go from their reception to the FISO. When I didn't arrive per original schedule, he rang Redhill who told him I'd departed at the right time so I must have crashed or got lost. Then he rang the registered owner of the plane (from G-INFO) who knew nothing of my plans, and then the police to see if any accidents had been reported. I'm not being churlish - it was good of him to care and I appreciate it, even though it was outside his remit. But I did get an icy "report to the tower" when I arrived, and the start of a bollocking.

Thank heavens I *had* rung with the revised ETA - I had been in two minds as to whether to bother. But it does raise the further PPR question - are you obliged to renew your PPR if details change? And if we are going to have a non-standard thing like PPR in the UK, could we at least have the expected service standardised?!

[Rob P]

If a FISO attempted to commence 'a bollocking' aimed at me based on his home-brewed requirement for a pseudo flight plan he might well be surprised by the response.

Rob P