Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
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By rikur_
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1861187
WelshRichy wrote:.... he's given up doing CAA medicals due to the god awful system that is CELLMA. I very much doubt he is alone.

Mine has too

Joking aside - the system can't cope with you visiting it twice. If you've visited the website before, and want to use it again, you either have to delete your cookies (tedious) or use your browser in 'incognito' mode.
#1861199
The whole CAA Medicals & CELLMA issue has definitely riled me enough to get me to register with flyer to reply to this thread.

I applaud & appreciate the intent of the CAA in digitizing the admin process with the intent of efficiency for all parties. However, the current state is a mess and it appears to be unsuitable for users and AMEs. The CAA website was initially and is still not fit for purpose and CELLMA is an off-the-shelf existing RioMed GP Medical Practice patient management system shoehorned onto the side with no changes that would amend the process or workflow to make it suitable for the task of providing service to the users.

I also notice that this morning 26th July the whole CAA portal is down only providing a server 503 (Service Unavailable) error.

My first issue was that for many months - I could not actually get a working login for the CAA portal (https://portal.caa.co.uk) no matter what I tried. I'd enter all the details - jump through the hoops - then not get the account verification email. The resend account activation email button and the forgotten password button didn't result in any steps forward. This happened repeatedly with the added complication that every time I created an account any attempt at using the Username resulted in "Username unavailable"! So over the many tries I'd exhausted Roger.Wilco001, Roger.Wilco002, ... Roger.Wilco999

I rang the CAA helpline and with a slightly shorter holding time than HSBC - I was able to speak to someone. They were courteous but unhelpful. I explained the problem that the CAA portal account activation was not working. That the account activation email was not being received etc...

I asked that as I only wanted a Class-2 renewal to restart training was there an alternative way to move forward while the portal issue was being sorted? - answer was effectively "NO" - "CAA Portal + CELLMA" or the highway.

I also asked if the CAA could kick one of my now multitude of CAA portal accounts and initiate the password reset their end - or cancel the multiple inactivated accounts as the majority of portal providers can do? - answer was that they have no access to the user management of their portal!

As I have run my own office/home IT infrastructure for over 8 years and been in a related industry my working career - I was in a position to at least look into what was happening and had identified and captured an abnormal/non-standard handshake between the CAA server sending the account activation email and my own infrastructure.

So I rang the CAA helpline again armed with the detail I had collected. As my CAA Portal Account woes seemed to hinge on the non-successful sending of the account verification email from their end. Again after finally getting to speak to someone who was courteous but unhelpful. I explained that I had useful information for the CAA's IT team or IT portal provider and either could they pass the detail onwards - or provide contact details of who I should communicate. Was told that they would not. Was told that it wasn't a CAA Infrastructure problem but must be my problem. I pointed out that the CAA had been communicating with me on that email address over the last year or more and so why was it my problem? The conversation basically ended with the CAA telling me - "use Gmail everyone else is". Beats me why I need multiple email addresses for the CAA?

Second problem was with (still is with) CELLMA. Once I have had a working CAA Portal - applying for and getting and accessing CELLMA account has been just as bad. Requesting a CELLMA account was reasonably straight forward from a working CAA Portal. Though, for ages I kept getting a "not enough licenses" error when trying to initialize my CELLMA account. Eventually, that did resolve but it took many attempts over a month. The only way to access the CAA variant of CELLMA is through the CAA Portal. I have had consistent issues jumping from the CAA Portal to CELLMA where I get token errors, or logout errors (while trying to login), or just plain old server 500 or 400 errors. Successful access to CELLMA initially was maybe only one in five attempts. It seems to have improved a bit - but I'm trying to avoid going anywhere near it.

So it has taken three months + to get to a point of being able to request a Class-2 renewal. I won't be holding my breath hoping for a smooth issuing process.

RioMed's sales blurb about CELLMA doesn't bode well for users or Medical Practitioners as they don't seem to be a priority and are not mentioned at all. Seems the only advantage of CELLMA is for
"evidence-based data aligned towards proper surveillance and monitoring"
for the CAA. https://www.riomed.com/cellmas-aviation-authority-medical-records-system/
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By WelshRichy
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1861262
GrahamB wrote:Roll on eLicensing.

We’ll all be grounded for months. :roll:


That's the idea, isn't it? :lol: :lol: :lol:

<apologies this reply has turned into a rant>

If they aren't trying to ground us by raising our collective blood pressure by introducing a not fit for purpose medical system, nor is it for ratings taking months to appear on ones licence, or if it isn't for ratings to magically disappear from ones licence when adding another, they're going to roll out another automatic system that isn't fit for purpose.

Probably on the pretence they can then ditch the final human staffing FCL and instead switch on an automated phone system saying "the computer says no" over and over again. Much cheaper than paying real humans who know the regulations inside and out. Maybe they do already and we haven't noticed? :lol:

Bring back the CAA from '98 when it took only four days for my PPL licence to land in my hands after sending my application off. Okay that was rather quick and took me by surprise (and my club when I called to book an aeroplane) but they were the good old days. When we could actually talk to real people who knew the regulations and could help. If they couldn't then they would know who to go to. Much better than the watered down rubbish we have now.

What is that saying our DFT/CAA have? Make UK the best place for GA? Probably for the Biz Jet market yes it may well be going that way. Give Farnborough lots of airspace. After all Biz Jets are GA. I think they have forgotten about the rest of GA in their appetite for GA greatness in the UK. They have a very long way to go to beat the USA/FAA who themselves aren't perfect but have their house in a much better state than our lot do. And I don't mean no landing fees as we'll never get those like in the USA as their airports are FAA/Government funded infrastructure but I mean licencing (certification), medicals, airworthiness. It just works. Temporary Airman Certificates for crying out loud. Trust your PPL examiners to issue temporary licences like you do FI Examiners. It would cut out a lot of ill-feeling in the community and would be a huge win.

</rant over>
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By rohmer
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1861378
My PMD is due to expire on my big 70 next month so, anticipating the problems that have been reported here, I applied to get a new PMD earlier this month. Except it worked fine! I have a shiny new PMD but it's still only valid until I turn 70, when I'll have to reapply! Confirmed by a telephone call to CAA Medical Admin dept.
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By johnm
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1861745
NigelC wrote:https://www.riomed.com/our-products/

Of course it may be a wonderful system banjaxed by our wonderful Civil Service.


This from their website might offer a clue......
Completely configurable to meet the exact needs of each individual client malleable in terms of modules, features and aesthetics.


Public sector systems are generally designed for the convenience of "service" supplier rather than the user in my experience, with a few honourable exceptions where both seem to have been considered, at least to a degree.....
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