[David Wood]

OK, so here's a question. I should declare in advance that I now know the answer, having after the event had a telephone conversation with a very helpful guy at the relevant Ops. But I'd be interested to hear other people's interpretations of the issue.

It's a sunny day and you plan a VFR bimble. The route takes you through a Danger Area. So prior to walking out you call up the relevant Ops' telephone number and you ask them for the status of the DA. The helpful chap on the end of the line tells you words to the effect "the DA is NOTAM'd as active to [whatever]. But we can't tell you now whether it will actually be active when you get there. So give us a call on 123.456 when you get close." So far, so good.

Off you go. As you near the DA you call on the relevant frequency to ask if the DA is active and whether or not you can cross. The reply is "D999 is inactive (sic), but we cannot give you a crossing service." You ask whether there is another callsign/freq that can give you a crossing and you are told that there is not.

So, the exam question of the day is: are you OK to cross the DA without further reference? Or, if you do so, are you infringing a DA?

[GrahamB]

Off the top of my head - you've had confirmation it's inactive so you can cross.

[lobstaboy]

That all seems very strange.
I'd say you were okay to cross without further reference.
An authority source has told you it's inactive. Presumably there can't be a crossing service of an inactive DA.
I bet I'm wrong, though, and it's more Byzantine than that...

[LysanderV8]

It’s a Danger Area, not a Restricted Area, so I think Graham B is correct, although something in my head is muttering about some DAs being subject to ByeLaws which could make us wrong.

[PortAndCheese]

I guess you’re OK to cross.
Depends a little on whether the frequency provides a crossing service (DACS) or an information service (DAAIS).
The DAAIS can tell you if it’s active or not. If not active, you’re good to go.
If it’s active, you need to contact a DACS and get a positive clearance to enter/cross.

Easily typed from the comfort of my living room, opinions might differ if I were heading towards a shooting range!

[Dave W]

Perhaps the answer depends on whether or not the DA has an associated byelaw.

[TopCat]

I don't know the answer to this, so I'm going to guess.... that if the DA authority says that the DA is inactive, that overrides the NOTAM, and that the DA is fine to cross without a crossing service.

If it's not active, why would you even need a crossing service?

....

Ok, so now I've had a look in the Skyway Code, and found this:

"If it can be established that the DA is ‘cold’ or a crossing service is available, then this can avoid unnecessary diversions around large DAs. If in doubt, remain outside. Danger areas with a broken boundary are activated by NOTAM"

I'm going to interpret my bold 'or' as meaning that you don't need to divert around if it's inactive, or if it's active and there's a crossing service.

So I'll stick with my guess.

[lobstaboy]

Ok, so now I've had a look in the Skyway Code, and found this:
....

Hey! Looking it up is cheating?

[skydriller]

Doesnt matter if its a Class C/D zone, Restricted Area or Danger Area...
...inactive is just what it says on the tin...Id fly through no worries.

Regards, SD..

[Rob P]

Our local danger area is D208, if declared 'Cold' by Lakenheath it can be flown across without further consultation

Rob P

[Ibra]

There are Danger Areas that are prohibted areas when they are active, they are small and have (*), I would never cross them, even on Radar Services I double check with ATC

For the rest of Danger Areas (non Prohibted Areas), I am happy to go inside, if there is DACS or DAIS it's better, if not it's not the end of the world even if they are active: some are huge for anyone to be concerned with whatever Mickey Mouse activity going on, I flew them mostly in gliders, the assumption is that the only thing that can hit a glider is another glider

I would not bother asking anyone if I can cross when told they are "cold", what is the point? making sure ATS own full responsability if something bad happens to me?

Reminds me of someone who asked AG operator on RT, "can you clear me for a bad weather circuit?", I don't think they can answer that by YES/NO but he reply "unofficial cloudbase is 700ft agl", up to you

[David Wood]

Well, having spoken the supervisor at the Ops unit in question (because, to be honest, I didn't know the answer with sufficient certainty to be sure) the answer is apparently this.

If telephoned, the Ops unit will merely advise that the DA is notam'd Active and advise the pilot to call upon approaching it. The logic is that they can't know what the activity state would be in, say, three hours time, and so they can't grant or imply a clearance in advance. Fair enough.

When calling the Ops unit on the RT the unit will advise whether the DA is Active or Not Active (CAP413 uses those terms, not Inactive, Hot or Cold). As an aside, the guy I was talking to on the RT used the term Inactive which was very difficult to distinguish from 'active' in an open cockpit. I had to ask him to repeat it three times. Hot and Cold, whilst non-standard, are less easily muddled, I suggest. What he actually said was "the DA is inactive, but I cannot give you a crossing clearance."

But anyway, understanding that it was inactive my initial thought was, 'Right, if it's inactive I'm OK to cross'. But then I thought, 'but if he's saying in his very next breath that he can't give me a crossing clearance then my inference there is that I need to have one.' Note, he didn't say "you don't need a clearance." Just that he couldn't give me a clearance, which sounds a lot like 'remain outside' to me. So I remained outside.

The supervisor was helpful in explaining their line to me afterwards on the phone. It is, as some of you correctly surmised: that if the Danger Area is notam'd as Active then it's Active unless it's Inactive in which case, whilst it is still technically a Danger Area and is still notam'd as active it's actually not active at that particular moment and so you may cross without a clearance as if it isn't there. Although it is. Okaaaay.

I guess that I could and probably should have worked that out but, given all all the stroppiness around infringements, it didn't seem worth blundering on on the basis of a best guess.

[NDB_hold]

I think @lobstaboy is probably correct:

The frequency gave you a DAAIS and told you the DA was not active.
DACS applies only to active DAs so the controller was correct that he couldn’t offer you a DACS through an inactive DA.

[James Chan]

if the Danger Area is notam'd as Active then it's Active unless it's Inactive in which case, whilst it is still technically a Danger Area and is still notam'd as active it's actually not active at that particular moment and so you may cross without a clearance as if it isn't there. Although it is. Okaaaay.

Why can't they just keep it simple and stupid:
- If it's active then you must ask if you can enter.
- If it's inactive then you must be able to use the airspace without asking.

[lobstaboy]

It does sound like something Lewis Carroll would have made up. Or Douglas Adams.