Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
By G-JWTP
#1835571
Quick one here.

Can anyone let me know of any closure or withdrawal of service of any LARS unit since 2013.
I know a few but I would like a better list.

Thanks,

G-JWTP
By chevvron
#1835579
Cottesmore or was that earlier?
I often handed traffic direct to them when I was operating Farnborough North and they often handed traffic to us too.
The boundaries of North and East could easily be expanded using Pease Pottage radar for East and Debden for North; both are situated on high ground and have excellent low coverage.
With Pease you can see traffic down to ground level at Shoreham and 400ft amsl at Pevensey Bay; with Debden you can see traffic to ground level at Wyton.
Last edited by chevvron on Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
By Shoestring Flyer
#1835592
Coltishall used to be a LARS unit.....although that may have been earlier?
Luton also used to be a LARS unit unsure what year it stopped being though.
St Mawgen also which of course is now Newquay.
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By Rob P
#1835645
@G-JWTP

I haven't the time to wade through seven pages, but there may be some interest here?

viewtopic.php?t=106873

Rob P
By chevvron
#1835659
Rob P wrote:@G-JWTP

I haven't the time to wade through seven pages, but there may be some interest here?

viewtopic.php?t=106873

Rob P

Yeah but that was based on the premise that LARS was there to reduce Airproxs' and took no account of it preventing infringements which is what London LARS was primarily introduced for in 2007/2008.
User avatar
By AlanM
#1835663
Whilst not LARS (only operating down to FL70 and up to FL245), Western Radar have been unavailable since the pandemic started. They are again NOTAMd out of service.

As in fact are Plymouth LARS, and have been for a long time. (Yeah, I know they are not disbanded but interesting either way)
By G-JWTP
#1835668
I'm on the CAA Virtual Summit next week and they have asked for questions.

The CAA seem to continue to say in 2013 and 2017 that they want to expand LARS which hasn't happened, in fact its got smaller. With the expansion of EC I was wondering if ever it was going to happen or whether EC is going to make LARS go the way of the Dodo.

G-JWTP
By chevvron
#1835673
G-JWTP wrote:I'm on the CAA Virtual Summit next week and they have asked for questions.

The CAA seem to continue to say in 2013 and 2017 that they want to expand LARS which hasn't happened, in fact its got smaller. With the expansion of EC I was wondering if ever it was going to happen or whether EC is going to make LARS go the way of the Dodo.

G-JWTP

It'll only get bigger if NATS ERL allocate more money to it which is highly unlikely.
In 1986, planning for Swanwick included ten 'FIR Radar' positions thereby taking the task away from airfields.
EC or not, there will always be some aircraft unable to carry it or pilots unwilling to use it so there will always be a need for LARS in some form.
By G-JWTP
#1835674
chevvron wrote:
G-JWTP wrote:I'm on the CAA Virtual Summit next week and they have asked for questions.

The CAA seem to continue to say in 2013 and 2017 that they want to expand LARS which hasn't happened, in fact its got smaller. With the expansion of EC I was wondering if ever it was going to happen or whether EC is going to make LARS go the way of the Dodo.

G-JWTP

It'll only get bigger if NATS ERL allocate more money to it which is highly unlikely.
In 1986, planning for Swanwick included ten 'FIR Radar' positions thereby taking the task away from airfields.
EC or not, there will always be some aircraft unable to carry it or pilots unwilling to use it so there will always be a need for LARS in some form.


Does the MOD benefit from DFT/LARS funding or do they just bear the cost?

G-JWTP
By chevvron
#1835682
G-JWTP wrote:Does the MOD benefit from DFT/LARS funding or do they just bear the cost?

G-JWTP

Yes but they get a single lump sum to cover all their LARS units rather than payments to individual civil airfields.
When NATS NSL started Farnborough North and East they funded it themselves (installation of extra control positions and extra radar feeds etc) from their own 'contingency fund' but I believe this has changed since then (2008).
Civil ATSUs are paid on a sliding scale based on the number of hours per week they provide LARS starting at mon - fri 9-5 up to 24/7
G-JWTP liked this
By johnm
#1835905
I get the distinct feeling that traffic in any class G airspace is going to be going down the EC route and that LARS will disappear.

Class E will have mandatory transponder to facilitate IFR separation

It's all about cost and drones I tell ee