[Joe Dell]

Add? Perfect as it is!


5. On climb out ensure you have a good look out, avoid turns of more than 15 degrees when climbing..

Wouldn't that make the 90 degree turn onto crosswind impossible?

Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not! They mean a 15 degree bank angle limit.

Just pointing out that a bank angle should be called a bank angle. Not a turn.

[ak7274]

A Defined Minimum Manouvering Speed has been suggested by some experts across the pond.
A minimum of 1.404 X the clean stall speed allows for controllable flight at bank angles up to 30°.
They suggest marking the ASI.

[rusty eagle]

I've only had one engine failure and the best advice that stuck in my head was that simple instruction from Bob Hoover 'fly the aircraft all the way to the crash.' That just means keeping airspeed and control. My incident ended without problems and a reusable aircraft.

[Rob P]

A minimum of 1.404 X the clean stall speed allows for controllable flight at bank angles up to 30°.

For my aircraft the difference between 1.4 x clean stall and 1.404 X clean stall amounts to 0.2 knots.

I think I'll call it 1.5.

Rob P

[defcribed]

I have no idea what a threat and error check is. I would have appreciated a link from this phrase.

I believe it's an aviation safety buzz-term which in the real world translates loosely as "consider the various ways in which things might all go to c*ck".

Apparently some people don't do this automatically as part of trying to stay alive and have to be told to do it. Amazing, but hey there's nowt as queer as folk.

[Trent772]

A Defined Minimum Manouvering Speed has been suggested by some experts across the pond.
A minimum of 1.404 X the clean stall speed allows for controllable flight at bank angles up to 30°.
They suggest marking the ASI.

I agree it would give many pilots a guide, however, there should be more reference to the relationship between stick position/angle of attack. It is usually the unintentional increase in stick back pressure that aggravates the situation leading to LOC.

[johnm]

This is quite a readable article on Threat and Error Management

Fundamentally it boils down to how you plan to cope with things going wrong and mistakes made by you and others.

[ak7274]

A Defined Minimum Manouvering Speed has been suggested by some experts across the pond.
A minimum of 1.404 X the clean stall speed allows for controllable flight at bank angles up to 30°.
They suggest marking the ASI.

I agree it would give many pilots a guide, however, there should be more reference to the relationship between stick position/angle of attack. It is usually the unintentional increase in stick back pressure that aggravates the situation leading to LOC.

Very much agree with you Mike, but some pilots would just fly it into the ground pulling back. At least a number to stay above will help some of the Dimmocks stay alive, even if they don't know why.

[MikeE]

Some notes on threat and error management, with some examples (taken from Skybrary and elsewhere) -

Threats
Threats are defined as “events or errors that occur beyond the influence of the flight crew, increase operational complexity, and which must be managed to maintain the margins of safety”.

During typical flight operations, flight crews have to manage various contextual complexities. Such complexities would include, for example, dealing with adverse meteorological conditions, airports surrounded by high mountains, congested airspace, aircraft malfunctions, errors committed by other people outside of the cockpit, such as air traffic controllers, flight attendants or maintenance workers, and so forth.

The TEM model considers these complexities as threats because they all have the potential to negatively affect flight operations by reducing margins of safety.

Anticipated Threats
Some threats can be anticipated, since they are expected or known to the flight crew. For example, flight crews can anticipate the consequences of a thunderstorm by briefing their response in advance, or prepare for a congested airport by making sure they keep a watchful eye for other aircraft as they execute the approach.
Unexpected Threats
Some threats can occur unexpectedly, such as an in-flight aircraft malfunction that happens suddenly and without warning. In this case, flight crews must apply skills and knowledge acquired through training and operational experience.
Latent Threats
Lastly, some threats may not be directly obvious to, or observable by, flight crews immersed in the operational context, and may need to be uncovered by safety analysis. These are considered latent threats. Examples of latent threats include equipment design issues, optical illusions, or shortened turn-around schedules.
Errors
Errors are defined “actions or inactions by the flight crew that lead to deviations from organisational or flight crew intentions or expectations”. Unmanaged and/or mismanaged errors frequently lead to undesired aircraft states. Errors in the operational context thus tend to reduce the margins of safety and increase the probability of adverse events.

Errors can be spontaneous (i.e., without direct linkage to specific, obvious threats), linked to threats, or part of an error chain. Examples of errors would include the inability to maintain stabilised approach parameters, executing a wrong automation mode, failing to give a required callout, or misinterpreting an ATC clearance

Hope that's helpful

Regards

Mike

[skydriller]

Some notes on threat and error management,

Thanks Mike, though that does seem to be a rather over-complicated way to say :

Plan the flight properly.
What might go wrong?
What will you do if it does?

Rregards, SD..

[Rob P]

You'll never make it into HR senior management with that attitude SD.

Rob P

[Trent772]

You'll never make it into HR senior management with that attitude SD.

Rob P

Human Remains are the most hated departments in most companies.

How ironic that after the demise of Thomas Cook last September, that HR were still fully staffed and paid - 6 months later....

[johnm]

You'll never make it into HR senior management with that attitude SD.

Rob P

I spent quite a bit of my later career explaining to HR and procurement that they didn’t get to tell me what to do, they were there to find legitimate means for me to do what I wanted to do. We did use quite a lot of brain fuses

[Rob P]

Time was the function was called Personnel and consisted of two old duffers straight from staff jobs in REME and the prettiest secretary in the factory as they saw all the applicants first. Their job was to sort the possibles from the dross in recruitment and to find reasons to keep pay (not theirs) as low as possible all round. They could also draw a mean organisation chart, an occupation that took up much of the time before lunch in the subsidised canteen.

HR is an arcane function whose prime objective is to get their headcount as close to a 1:1 ratio with the entirety of all the other departments added together.

No surprise which 'Ark' they were assigned to in 'Hitchikers'

Rob P

[Trent772]

Time was the function was called Personnel and consisted of two old duffers straight from staff jobs in REME and the prettiest secretary in the factory as they saw all the applicants first. Their job was to sort the possibles from the dross in recruitment and to find reasons to keep pay (not theirs) as low as possible all round. They could also draw a mean organisation chart, an occupation that took up much of the time before lunch in the subsidised canteen.

HR is an arcane function whose prime objective is to get their headcount as close to a 1:1 ratio with the entirety of all the other departments added together.

No surprise which 'Ark' they were assigned to in 'Hitchikers'

Rob P

Oh my word...... priceless !!!



Now, get a Cabin Pressure reference in and you will truly be omnipotent !