Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
#1778413
Dave W wrote:Yes; helicopters.


Really?

Profiles may involve dynamic lateral and vertical manoeuvring of aircraft at speeds up to 450 knots


Eggbeaters certainly have come on, haven't they?

https://notaminfo.com/localarea?notam=1284718

Rob P
#1778415
UK AIP GEN 3.1 advertises the email address aissupervisor@nats.co.uk as a contact point.

We almost included a "report this NOTAM" feature in SkyDemon which would allow you to express your concerns about any NOTAM and would forward them via email to the appropriate authority as published in the relevant AIP. We were talked out of doing that by someone who thought the recipients wouldn't appreciate it, I suspect they were correct.

Anyway, do use that email address to report a badly-written NOTAM. It's part of what it's there for.
G-BLEW liked this
#1778427
Rob P wrote:
Dave W wrote:Yes; helicopters.


Really?

Well, yes. Because that's what HEL stands for in the NOTAM abbreviation list.

Interestingly, the NOTAM you quote* refers to AIC Y056/2020. That AIC isn't shown in [url=Thta]the current NATS list[/url], which only goes up to Y037/2020!


*Your link doesn't work for me, BTW - it seems to require a login.
PeteSpencer liked this
#1778437
Image

Now I have googled and discovered

The official FAI speed record for helicopters is 400.87 km/h (249.09 mph) and was set by John Trevor Eggington with co-pilot Derek J Clews, over Glastonbury, Somerset, England on 11 August 1986 in a Westland Lynx demonstrator.


So are we to assume these 450 knot helicopters are ultra top secret, which is why they are skulking around darkest Suffolk late at night? :wink:

Rob P

For clarification the NOTAM quote and supposed link came from here:

https://notaminfo.com/node/5

As does the cut and paste at the front of this post. Not a site I ever use, but I couldn't copy and paste from SD
#1778440
Following on from my efforts to get our strip on the ArmyAir LFA charts (work in progress) I had a phone call this very morning from an Apache pilot at Watt asking if we were flying today as he was planning a sortie in a 10km box including our strip, down to height 25m.

(Pending an entry on their LFA chart they have very kindly put an awareness notice up in their LFA Ops briefing room)

He also asked if he could land on our strip which sadly I declined due to our noise sensitive areas.

He was a bit gobsmacked to hear the aeromodellers have a CAA exemption for fly over 400ft up to 1000ft.

Peter
Flyin'Dutch' liked this
#1778441
So are we to assume these 450 knot helicopters are ultra top secret, which is why they are skulking around darkest Suffolk late at night?



No expert, but, what is a high energy manoeuvers for a helo doesn't equate to the same for fixed wing. I read that notam as to include fast moving jet traffic in combination with ground support helos also doing their own high energy moves. But probably wrong.
#1778447
flyingearly wrote:This thread is really helpful, but I wanted to flag a question - and possibly an example of where there is ambiguity.

A) EGMC
B) FROM: 20/06/18 15:15
C) TO: 20/06/30 19:00


This is down to the reading of NOTAMs, which should be taught, but often isn't taught properly. This line is the effective time the NOTAM is valid. If you plan your flight within this time, the NOTAM will be shown. If you plan your flight outside this period, it'll mean the NOTAM isn't of use to you so it won't. It's not to do with any activation times of airspace or anything. That comes later:

flyingearly wrote:E) SOUTHEND CTA, CTR, ATZ DEACTIVATED. AD CLOSED. NO ATS AVBL
SCHEDULE: 1515-1900


This describes what the NOTAM is and when the bits described are valid. So it's saying, "SCHEDULE: 1515-1900". Since it doesn't specify any days, I would assume this is every day, from the start time of the NOTAM validity (B) to the end (C).

It's not really ambiguous. It's only ambiguous if you don't read it!

We're not at the stage where we have fully automated NOTAMs yet, so all a mapping program can do is highlight the NOTAM and interpret it the best it can for ease of display, it's up to the user to read what it says.

Another big bit of confusion seems to be when the NOTAM has a circle around it, to show how far away from the epicentre that people should be notified that the NOTAM exists. This has, time and time again on forums, been mistaken to be the actual diameter of any restriction or what-have-you, rather than just the circle to highlight the NOTAM.
Hawkwind, patowalker, GonzoEGLL and 2 others liked this
#1778448
FlarePath wrote:
So are we to assume these 450 knot helicopters are ultra top secret, which is why they are skulking around darkest Suffolk late at night?



No expert, but, what is a high energy manoeuvers for a helo doesn't equate to the same for fixed wing. I read that notam as to include fast moving jet traffic in combination with ground support helos also doing their own high energy moves. But probably wrong.


Correct: I once got them to hold off a FJ for 15 minutes when our strip was overlapped by 2 x AGL to 15000ft lobes of notams while I scurried back home from maintenance airfield .

I could hear him circling overhead till time I gave for ETA plus a few minutes, then I heard him open up the taps................

Peter
#1778450
FlarePath wrote:No expert, but, what is a high energy manoeuvers for a helo doesn't equate to the same for fixed wing. I read that notam as to include fast moving jet traffic in combination with ground support helos also doing their own high energy moves. But probably wrong.


That's the only sensible conclusion I can come to also. But if they are going to the trouble of putting HEL for helicopters, why have they not put in FJ (or whatever) for the proper aircraft?

It doesn't matter one jot, it's all happening at a time I am very unlikely to be flying my no lights aircraft from the no lights aerodrome. It's just more NOTAM stupidity.

Rob P