Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
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By VRB_20kt
#1771213
You could make each member responsible for his/her own safety.

I’d also request each member not to fly if they had CV19 symptoms.

It’d be interesting to know the relative risk from flying compared to CV19 being transmitted via a cockpit.
#1771220
Why don't we demand guidance from the CAA?

And treat flying group aeroplanes as banned until we have it?

:lol:

Seriously, just be sensible and considerate to your fellow owners. Don't fly if you feel a bit coviddy. Wipe things down if you want to.

Overall you're responsible for your own safety. The inside and outside of an aeroplane are always going to be potentially contaminated surfaces unless it lives alone in a hangar to which only you have a key. If your own personal requirements are for zero risk of contracting the virus, then you probably need to not touch aeroplanes the same as you wouldn't touch anything else that isn't at home.
DarrenL liked this
#1771232
I put this together for the several syndicates I'm in, based upon formal advice from CAA, WHO, EASA and UK Government. People seem to find it helpful. This is actually the third iteration - I've been amending it as new advice comes out. Feel free to use it, or to suggest improvements. For the record, I found about 2 litres of soapy water (plus other materials) did a PA28.

Introduction
This is produced with no official sanction or support whatsoever. It is the best advice I can offer after reviewing all of the official guidance from the UK government, UK CAA, EASA and World Health Organisation I can find.

This is version 1.2 dated 21 May 2020.

Personal Equipment
The following should all be personal equipment, and shared with nobody.
- Headset
- All flying clothing
- Checklists, kneeboards, chart etc.
- Manuals

A mask isn’t essential, but some kind of face covering whilst cleaning isn’t a bad idea.

Briefing

If this is your first flight in a while, review the latest documents from CAA and the sport flying associations about getting yourself back into the air safely.

If at all uncertain about your currency and abilities, get a briefing on the phone / Zoom / Skype / whatever from an instructor.

If you haven’t flown for a while, take a few hours to refamiliarize yourself with the contents of the flight manual, checklist, and local charts. Don’t rush this, if you make a mistake there will be loads of time after to consider it, but you’d rather not.

Cleaning
You will need:-
- Tissues and/or soft cloths
- A bottle of kitchen cleaner with bleach (or minimum 1% bleach in water solution). Check the warning data for any bleach containing cleaner and DO NOT use anything containing hydrogen peroxide, which can damage the cockpit.
- If you have them, alcohol based wipes (NOT standard antibacterial wipes)
- A bucket of soapy water with a sponge
- Some old towels and/or paper towels (second is better).
- Bin bags.

If you can, also something washable (e.g. a blanket or old sheet) you can put over the seat(s) and/or consider wearing a flying coverall that can be washed.

I recommend that you do the following both before, and after, flying. This is in addition to all the usual clean windscreen, DI, etc. actions that are also essential.

(1) Wash your hands in soap and water for at-least 20 seconds.

(2) Wash over with soap and water the doors and door catches, around the fuel fillers, cowling & access panel catches, oil dipstick, handholds, propeller, and anything else you’re likely to touch external to the aeroplane.

(3) Open up, and clean the following either with bleach spray, carefully with soapy water or with alcohol wipes. Bleach spray should be left on for 60 seconds, then wiped off thoroughly.
a. All flying controls (including trimmers, brake levers avionics controls, touch screens)
b. Plastic seats, and all trims close enough to be touched by the pilot (ditto any passengers you’re taking)
c. The aircraft keys.

(4) Put something under the harnesses and clean them with soapy water (avoid either alcohol or bleach, which may damage the nylon webbing), before drying them as well as you can.

(5) Wipe over any touch screens with something suitable. Small amounts of soapy water, or alcohol based screen wipes are probably best.

(6) Consider putting a washable cover over the seats (e.g. a towel).

(7) Wash your hands again.

Put everything you’ve used for cleaning and/or covers in one of two pairs of sealed plastic bags, one inside the other. I’d recommend separating clothing/cloths, from everything else. Clothing/cloths want subsequently washing at 60°C or hotter (and handle them as little as possible then wash your hands). Everything else, store somewhere safe for at least 3 days, then throw it in a dustbin, still bagged.

Personally, flying in a shared aeroplane, I’ll also have worn a flying suit, and afterwards be washing that the same way.

Don’ts
Don’t use compressed air, steamers, pressure washers. Don’t start with a vacuum cleaner. These may spread the virus around (and pressure washers tend to flush out lubrication).
Don’t use an ioniser; it can damage some critical materials.
Don’t get liquids into the electrics and electronics.
Don’t use rough cloths on instruments and canopies.
Don’t breath in the cleaning chemicals. If it can harm a virus, it can probably harm you too.
Don’t fly with anybody from outside your own household.

Everything else
Other areas (e.g. offices, rest areas, toilets, doors, light switches) are not specifically aviation activities. There’s advice out there about keeping them safe – use it. Where UK government advice does not exist, follow World Health Organisation advice.
UK Government advice: https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus
WHO advice: https://www.who.int/emergencies/disease ... for-public
CAA advice: https://www.caa.co.uk/COVID-19/
EASA Advice: https://www.easa.europa.eu/newsroom-and ... el-despite
Follow all other government advice on social distancing, etc. It matters.


G
LysanderV8, kanga, Aerials liked this
#1771235
Has anyone managed to identify a cleaning product that is both effective and won't damage the aircraft/avionics (preferable as a wipe)? I've found these two possibilities:

This is specific to aviation: https://www.frasersaerospace.com/product/bacoban-for-aerospace-wipes/ and hence is bloody expensive.

This looks a possibility: https://www.2xlcorp.com/2xl-100-gymwipes-antibacterial/ as it is supposed to be kind to electronics kit, but looks like only sold in wholesale quantities.
#1771238
LysanderV8 wrote:Making everyone responsible for their own safety is fine. But they need also to be responsible for ensuring that they do not imperil others by their lack of conscientiousness in cleaning.


I would tend to put the cleaning/disinfecting responsibility onto the person who wants it cleaned/disinfected because of their own attitude-to-risk requirements, i.e. clean it before you fly if you want it cleaned.

That way if you need it cleaned then you KNOW it's been cleaned and cleaned to your standards. Do you trust your fellow shareholder (who you may not know very well at all) with your virus-related safety?

@Genghis the Engineer that is quite a list/process. I can't see many people going to that much trouble, but I could be wrong. The age/health profile of the average UK GA pilot is not exactly young and super-fit, so perhaps the fear of contracting it is enough to get people to do this.

Here's hoping the regulator has got better things to do that mandate something like this.
LysanderV8 liked this
#1771240
I don't think that the regulator is mandating anything like this, but it took me 10 minutes tops before and after a very pleasant 2hr flight on Saturday, and everybody else says they found it worked fine for them also.

Basically, it's the best I could come up with. I've lost a relative and a colleague to this plague so far, know several people who appear to be "enjoying" long term health impacts after "recovering", and was forced this week to attend by video conference another colleague's funeral - who died of something else. That's worth 20 minutes of my time per flight.

Give it time, Tim can probably arrange for it to be done by SkyDemon, but for now, it's manually I'm afraid.

G
User avatar
By gaxor
#1771392
Grey Beard wrote:Has anyone managed to identify a cleaning product that is both effective and won't damage the aircraft/avionics (preferable as a wipe)? I've found these two possibilities:

This is specific to aviation: https://www.frasersaerospace.com/product/bacoban-for-aerospace-wipes/ and hence is bloody expensive.

This looks a possibility: https://www.2xlcorp.com/2xl-100-gymwipes-antibacterial/ as it is supposed to be kind to electronics kit, but looks like only sold in wholesale quantities.


From Garmin
Disinfecting your Garmin Avionics:



To safely disinfect your display, we recommend using an isopropyl alcohol solution (70% alcohol) that does not contain ammonia. For other exposed surfaces such as knobs, buttons, and bezels, cleaners such as soap & water and alcohol based cleaners are recommended. We do not recommend bleach-based cleaners, or ammonia based cleaners.



Garmin recommends only 70% isopropyl alcohol (isopronanol) for the best combination of bactericidal effectiveness and equipment safety.



The solution must be at least 70% alcohol and the surface must remain wet for at least 30 seconds to be effective. Also, the CDC recommends wearing disposable gloves when disinfecting surfaces.
By chrisbl
#1771399
defcribed wrote:Why don't we demand guidance from the CAA?

And treat flying group aeroplanes as banned until we have it?

:lol:

Seriously, just be sensible and considerate to your fellow owners. Don't fly if you feel a bit coviddy. Wipe things down if you want to.

Overall you're responsible for your own safety. The inside and outside of an aeroplane are always going to be potentially contaminated surfaces unless it lives alone in a hangar to which only you have a key. If your own personal requirements are for zero risk of contracting the virus, then you probably need to not touch aeroplanes the same as you wouldn't touch anything else that isn't at home.


This came out on 27th March it says if you have or suspect you have COVID dont fly!

https://www.caa.co.uk/uploadedFiles/CAA ... 0march.pdf
User avatar
By MattL
#1771411
[in no way a dig at anyone or any views on this matter which are a personal choice]

I would also observe that anyone who feels they need hospital theatre levels of cleaning and protection to feel safe in the aircraft may wish to consider whether they are really in an appropriate state of mind/distraction to actually go flying, especially considering potential lack of currency. I have already seen people who have been so focussed on pre flight COVID issues they have got airborne without any NOTAM checking or consideration.
Rob P, GrahamB, PeteSpencer and 2 others liked this
#1771419
MattL wrote:[in no way a dig at anyone or any views on this matter which are a personal choice]

I would also observe that anyone who feels they need hospital theatre levels of cleaning and protection to feel safe in the aircraft may wish to consider whether they are really in an appropriate state of mind/distraction to actually go flying, especially considering potential lack of currency. I have already seen people who have been so focussed on pre flight COVID issues they have got airborne without any NOTAM checking or consideration.


Agreed:
My approach to aircraft de-Covidding lies somewhere on the spectrum between Ghengis' thoroughness and Trent772's complete derision.....

Peter :wink:
Trent772 liked this