Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
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By derekf
#1742285
I read it that we have until the end of 2020 where we will still seem like we're in EASA - from CAA Brexit info site front page:

It is now anticipated that the United Kingdom will leave the European Union (EU) on 31 January 2020. At that point, the UK and the EU will enter a transition period during which the UK and its aviation sector will continue to participate in European Aviation Safety Agency (EASA) systems and comply with its regulations while the longer-term UK-EU relationship on aviation is determined. The CAA will continue to provide advice on potential outcomes as negotiations progress. The transition period is currently due to finish on 31 December 2020.
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By PaulB
#1742292
I think that's right.... the withdrawal bill is still making it's way through parliament (being debated in Lords today (21/1/20))

The bill is here (as it stands at the moment)



It seems to "un-repeal" the European Communities Act 1972 so things will continue as normal until 31/12/20
By johnm
#1742304
Given the time available the obvious strategy would be bilateral arrangements maintaining the status quo in key technical areas like ours and a few bits of political grandstanding to keep the likes of the ERG on side.
Lockhaven, derekf, PaulB liked this
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By PaulB
#1743025
The Withdrawal Act, which amends the previous one, received Royal Assent the other day.

I'm guessing that as far as EASA stuff is concerned, it's just business as usual and the situation on 1st Feb is by and large the same as it is now?

I'm further guessing that during the transition period, any EU laws will automatically become law here. Are there any exceptions to that from an EASA standpoint?

I've just paused to read this on the EU commission website

EU wrote:The United Kingdom will no longer be a Member State of the European Union and of the European Atomic Energy Community as of 1 February 2020. As a third country, it will no longer participate in the EU's decision-making processes. In particular:

It will no longer participate in the EU institutions (such as the European Parliament and the Council), EU agencies, offices or other bodies.


Does that mean that we will lose all representation on EASA (it being an EU agency?)
By johnm
#1743045
As long as we remain a member of EASA we will have representation in the same way the Swiss and others like them do. We can also participate in EASA policy and plans. Where we cease to have any influence is on the basic regulation that governs EASA's activities.

As things stand I'm not clear on where all this now goes. Under the May agreement we had the political declaration which provided a framework for negotiation on the future relationship. I don't think that has any status now so we start with a clean sheet of paper.

In practical terms nothing much changes until the end of the year though I think the SOLI window may have closed in some cases.

The whole problem is that nothing is clear except that as of 31st Jan midnight CET we are no longer an EU state but are still treated as one for the purposes of everyday activities, we assume that HMG will negotiate a coherent position for December this year.
#1743046
@johnm

That is incorrect.

No UK MEPs in EP, no UK representatives at EASA meetings.

The first we know from the media, the second I know personally.
#1743048
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:@johnm

That is incorrect.

No UK MEPs in EP, no UK representatives at EASA meetings.

The first we know from the media, the second I know personally.


JohnM is correct, we can expect representation at all the working level stuff, just not at a parliamentary level That is the case now for e.g. Switzerland, or for that matter many Americans sitting on regulation development groups.

G
By johnm
#1743050
We can certainly be represented on the EASA management board and at the working level as the Swiss and Norwegians are. Whether we choose to go is a different matter of course, though I'd be amazed if Grant Shapps was that stupid.

Our representation at Council, Commission and EP ceases of course as we are no longer an EU state. The Swiss and Norwegians have never had such representation.
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By peter272
#1743076
Whether we choose to go is a different matter of course, though I'd be amazed if Grant Shapps was that stupid.


Never underestimate the ability of an ambitious politician to do stupid things when toeing the Party line leads to promotion. It is accepted generally there is no sense in recreating the CAA as was, but the alternative of remaining aligned with EASA doesn't fit the Government's narrative- at least, not at the moment
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By johnm
#1743079
At the risk of entering politics; as things stand the alignment discussion varies from hour to hour and I'm guessing that's because the Cabinet does not have an agreed plan to work to. They need something akin to the political declaration to give them a framework to start a series of parallel discussions on the various issues. There are quite a few across numerous departments!
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By Flyin'Dutch'
#1743080
@Genghis the Engineer and @johnm

You both are WRONG

Switzerland and Norway have both signed up to EASA and are not in a transition phase.
By johnm
#1743084
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:@Genghis the Engineer and @johnm

You both are WRONG

Switzerland and Norway have both signed up to EASA and are not in a transition phase.


I am willing to be corrected but as I understand it the transition phase implies that we remain members of EASA until the end of this year when we cease so to be unless we've signed up to something akin to the Swiss model??
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By Flyin'Dutch'
#1743089
johnm wrote:
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:@Genghis the Engineer and @johnm

You both are WRONG

Switzerland and Norway have both signed up to EASA and are not in a transition phase.


I am willing to be corrected but as I understand it the transition phase implies that we remain members of EASA until the end of this year when we cease so to be unless we've signed up to something akin to the Swiss model??


Well you clearly are not willing to be corrected as I have told you twice that your and Genghis' opinion is wrong. Incorrect. Not in keeping with the reality.
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By PaulB
#1743090
I posted this earlier

EU wrote:The United Kingdom will no longer be a Member State of the European Union and of the European Atomic Energy Community as of 1 February 2020. As a third country, it will no longer participate in the EU's decision-making processes. In particular:

It will no longer participate in the EU institutions (such as the European Parliament and the Council), EU agencies, offices or other bodies.


I wish I'd posted the URL (I usually do) but it was an official EU site. It seems to state that from next week, the UK will have no representation on EASA (being an EU agency).
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