Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
#1699745
Are these airports that GtE mentions the sort of place where average Jo(e) could get their loco commercial flight or re they what we might call GA airports?

Just curious, because I doubt we'll ever see anything like it, so comparisons with the US merely make for depressing reading as opposed to something politically achievable in the UK.

Edited to add, as I crossed with JohnM

johnm wrote:Europe does rather better too. IIRC Instrument approaches for Cherbourg are sequenced by Deauville for the FISO at Cherbourg.


Aren't these better comparisons, with the likes of Sywell, Coventry etc wanting GPS approaches?
#1699749
The fundamental problem is that light aviation is not seen as a mode of transport in Europe to the same degree it is in the USA.

In mainland Europe this is mitigated through public sector support for airports which keeps relatively low utilisation fields going because the overheads are relatively small and Chambers of Commerce have substantial influence and generally support the facilities.
#1699775
bilko2 wrote:If I was going to be the new PM I would close down the CAA and subcontract the whole operation to the FAA


... and how would that work given that our infrasctucture is significantly different to that of the US?
#1699776
PaulB wrote:Are these airports that GtE mentions the sort of place where average Jo(e) could get their loco commercial flight or re they what we might call GA airports?

Crystal River (as an example) is not used by any airlines. It has a lot of training, some private GA and charter flights. It brings money into the local community in the form of student pilots staying there for weeks (sometimes months) and visitors filling up, parking and holidaying. The business employs locals, uses local services and pays taxes. What's not to like?
#1699789
Flyingfemme wrote:Crystal River (as an example) is not used by any airlines. It has a lot of training, some private GA and charter flights. It brings money into the local community in the form of student pilots staying there for weeks (sometimes months) and visitors filling up, parking and holidaying. The business employs locals, uses local services and pays taxes. What's not to like?


We just haven't that here..... Which GA airport in the UK would you say is closest (or is it a combination of 2)?
#1699804
PaulB wrote:
Flyingfemme wrote:Crystal River (as an example) is not used by any airlines. It has a lot of training, some private GA and charter flights. It brings money into the local community in the form of student pilots staying there for weeks (sometimes months) and visitors filling up, parking and holidaying. The business employs locals, uses local services and pays taxes. What's not to like?


We just haven't that here..... Which GA airport in the UK would you say is closest (or is it a combination of 2)?


Skegness?
#1699817
We would need to sort out costs too for carrying out GPS approaches in UK.
For example I suppose for an approach into Blackbushe, we would be hit with the £20/30 fee plus I bet Farnborough would want to add on a charge for the Vectoring/ Control to the IAF.
Luckily for us in SE England we can use Calais, Le Touquet, Dieppe etc. all day at no cost for LPV Approaches. Other than of course a tank of Duty Free fuel and a nice meal in the airport 'caff'!

I bet too that many of these CAA Airspace "experts" have no idea what routinely happens in all weathers at even non tower airports in USA. Someone should arrange for them, for example, a mandatory U Tube evening watching Premier Pilot doing just that.
#1699839
in my experience virtually the whole of the profession on the non flying side of aviation ... have no interest in aviation.
As a part time pilot I've flown in several countries especially USA, which I feel has enhanced my knowledge.
Years ago at a LATCC seminar at West Drayton I asked what they had learnt from colleagues in other countries.....silence
#1699840
PaulB wrote:
Flyingfemme wrote:Crystal River (as an example) is not used by any airlines. It has a lot of training, some private GA and charter flights. It brings money into the local community in the form of student pilots staying there for weeks (sometimes months) and visitors filling up, parking and holidaying. The business employs locals, uses local services and pays taxes. What's not to like?


We just haven't that here..... Which GA airport in the UK would you say is closest (or is it a combination of 2)?

Haverfordwest, Welshpool, Old Sarum, Westonzoyland, Popham, Sandown, Lee on Solent, Fishburn, Rufforth, Compton Abbas....

That is the general scale and complexity of airfields routinely having GPS approaches, managed from elsewhere, in the USA.

If you want to compare the amount of scale and infrastructure, Lee on Solent without the Britten-Norman components would be about the same as Crystal River.

G
Last edited by Genghis the Engineer on Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
#1699844
In 2007/8 the CAA offered industry 6 free RNAV(GNSS)LNAV approaches. The grateful recipients included iirc -
    Shoreham
    Blackpool
    Exeter and
    Gloucestershire
This kick-started the development of CAP1122 and there were a large number of aerodromes keen to apply once the CAP was launched.

Incidentally that was at Aero Expo 2014 held at Sywell and launched by the Rt Hon Grant Shapps MP. (five years ago :shock: )

The aerodromes I've mentioned in a previous post were all on that founding list and their tenacity in continuing with the application process is praiseworthy indeed.

Industry will achieve the goal of 'GPS' approaches to smaller aerodromes eventually and I can only reiterate that there are a number of people out their working hard to realise that.
#1699845
diverdriver wrote:in my experience virtually the whole of the profession on the non flying side of aviation ... have no interest in aviation.
As a part time pilot I've flown in several countries especially USA, which I feel has enhanced my knowledge.
Years ago at a LATCC seminar at West Drayton I asked what they had learnt from colleagues in other countries.....silence


What was the seminar about?

Your experience doesn’t tally with mine.

We must be careful not to equate ‘aviation’ with ‘flying aeroplanes’.