Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 6
  • 7
#1693462
The BBC have it now.....

Amateur pilots being investigated after Sala death

BBC Radio Guernsey
Amateur pilots, who could be offering flights for money, are being investigated by Channel Island authorities.

The so-called grey charters are coming under close scrutiny after the death of the footballer Emiliano Sala and his pilot David Ibbotson.

Mr Ibbotson was not licensed to carry paying passengers and the tragedy has shone a light on the world of such charters.

These are unlicensed flights including the use of foreign-registered planes for air taxi work.

The director of civil aviation, Dominic Lazarus, who's in charge of non-commercial flying, confirmed there was one ongoing case and several others were being looked at.
Lockhaven liked this
#1693469
What was a little disappointing last night on the Jersey news was that they referred to illegal (gray) charters and FRA
It's not Foreign Registered Aircraft (FRA), it's the illegal charters under any registry
Interestingly, I'd suggest that the 2-reg is an FRA as much as an N-reg is where the CAA are concerned :roll:
Last edited by derekf on Tue May 14, 2019 6:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
AlanM liked this
#1693482
Can anyone post a link to the Jersey Air Law on cost sharing. I’ve just spent 30 minutes searching - and I keep ending up at the Jersey Law website - which won’t let me register.

I think we all have pootled across to France and the Channel Isles - sometimes with an informal cost sharing arrangement - and we have never considered that we might unknowingly be breaking some Jersey Law. I had always assumed that they followed UK and EASA rules.

As a moderately frequent visitor to the CI’s, I’d like to see the detailed rules, to ensure that I comply with them - rather than base it on a newspaper article.

If it becomes too difficult, we’ll just have to stop going there.
#1693484
Is this what you are looking for?

https://www.jerseylaw.je/laws/revised/Pages/03.250.aspx#_Toc504060517

105 Restriction with respect to carriage for valuable consideration in aircraft registered outside Jersey

(1) An aircraft registered in any other country other than the United Kingdom and its Territories and Dependencies, shall not take on board or discharge any passengers or cargo in Jersey, if valuable consideration is given or promised in respect of the carriage of such persons or cargo unless it does so with the permission of the Secretary of State granted under this Article to the operator or charterer of the aircraft or to the Government of the country in which the aircraft is registered, and in accordance with any conditions to which such permission may be subject.
#1693485
Lockhaven wrote:
defcribed wrote:
Dusty_B wrote:It was a bent charter because Sala believed it was a charter.


Somehow I doubt that's a legal definition. :wink:

The only real fact we know at the moment is that the pilot did not have a commercial license.


Slow down its a touch more than that.

1. No commercial licence, therefore payment cannot be legally received.

2. No instrument rating therefore flight in IMC/IFR conditions are illegal.

3. No night flying privileges due to a colour vision restriction, but flying was at night.

Lets not start watering down the severity of what occurred on that flight.


My apologies, I had focused on the commercial/non-commercial aspects of it.

Those other two points are indeed undisputed.
#1693492
Lefty wrote:Can anyone post a link to the Jersey Air Law on cost sharing. I’ve just spent 30 minutes searching - and I keep ending up at the Jersey Law website - which won’t let me register.

I think we all have pootled across to France and the Channel Isles - sometimes with an informal cost sharing arrangement - and we have never considered that we might unknowingly be breaking some Jersey Law. I had always assumed that they followed UK and EASA rules.

As a moderately frequent visitor to the CI’s, I’d like to see the detailed rules, to ensure that I comply with them - rather than base it on a newspaper article.

If it becomes too difficult, we’ll just have to stop going there.


Lefty - patowalker shared the link, but effectively the Jersey/Guernsey ANOs were based on the UK one so think old UK cost sharing (4 people including pilot 25% each)

The DCA has said that they will be updating the ANO at some stage and are lagging behind. He'd indicated in a meeting that he mainly focussed on any aspects of profit as opposed to whether the pilot pays the full 25%. Not sure how long it will take to get the anomaly fixed - law drafting is notoriously slow over here...
#1693495
Thanks.
I’ve read the law as linked by defcribed- and yes it is identical to the (out of date) UK regs. Namely max 4 POB and Direct costs split equally by POB.

UK & EASA rules state up to 6 POB and costs don’t need to be shared equally.

So when I fly to the CI’s 6 up, (officially) only 4 of us can share outbound - and a different 4 share on the return.
#1693554
defcribed wrote:Catching and convicting would obviously be very difficult.


You think? I believe that we are not talking about one-offs here. Watching the same aircraft file 8 FPLs each day back and forth and looking at POBs and GAR records must be easy.

Finding one passenger to cough under a police interrogation would be relatively easy I would suggest.

Serious investigation or a deterrent? We shall see
#1693565
Waveflyer wrote:
AlanM wrote:Finding one passenger to cough under a police interrogation would be relatively easy I would suggest.

Perhaps not a cough or interrogation. Just a straightforward witness statement and a whole load of problems for the operator.


Indeed. Or access to all the many cameras on the airfield......

Patterns are there. Intelligence is key.
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 6
  • 7