Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
#1663550
I've recently written a short blog post on landings, after a friend and I were discussing bouncing (and I vowed to write more this year). He passed on six words that were once directed into his ears by a certain aerobatics legend - and with that the jigsaw pieces suddenly came together in my own head. I also dug out GoPro footage of myself landing to compare before and after, which you can see.

It is really about wheelers and getting confident enough to do them. I'm not an instructor but, hopefully, it might help others out there who are learning tailwheel.

So far one further person has contacted me to say they also received the same six words, from the same chap! :thumleft:
Dave W, seanxair, Maxthelion and 3 others liked this
#1663564
Thanks for sharing, it's a great site you've been putting together there. I know from experience that getting an RV to not bounce when landing is certainly one of flying's bigger challenges. In the nicest possible way, I think the phrase you may have been reaching for was 'angle of attack' rather than 'incidence with reference to the ground'.
JonnyS liked this
#1663572
Having just briefly watched your videos I would say the root cause is you are sitting too low in the seat and approaching too low during the final, i.e dragging it in instead of making a continuous descent approach, the give away is how you are stretching your neck to look over the cowling.

But thats just my opinion I sure there will plenty of inputs to follow.
#1663578
What he said, you need a cushion, and coming in a bit slower. I know the stall warner is chirping but after your third touchdown you still have more than 50 mph/kts showing on the ASI.
#1663583
Maxthelion wrote:In the nicest possible way, I think the phrase you may have been reaching for was 'angle of attack' rather than 'incidence with reference to the ground'.


Thanks Max; and yes on reflection, I was over thinking it. The movement of the air mass over the wing is in exactly the same direction as the movement of the ground, when you're in contact with it.

@Lockhaven / @Flyin'Dutch' - annoyingly my head is banging the top of the canopy most of the time with my big headset. With my in-ear headset I can get a couple of inches higher but I soon run out of ear plugs for it.

Your point about dragging it in is noted, I think it stems from a personal worry that the speed might get out of hand with a steep approach. I'll try steeper and report back.
#1663586
JonnyS wrote:@Lockhaven / @Flyin'Dutch' - annoyingly my head is banging the top of the canopy most of the time with my big headset. With my in-ear headset I can get a couple of inches higher but I soon run out of ear plugs for it.

Your point about dragging it in is noted, I think it stems from a personal worry that the speed might get out of hand with a steep approach. I'll try steeper and report back.


What speed does the aeroplane stall at?

Take that and multiply by 1.3 and use that as the approach speed bleeding it off as you come in to the flare.

If you don't fit in the aeroplane I would be willing to take it off your hands for a suitably small sum, let's face it nobody wants an ill fitting aeroplane and yours looks a very nice one, so happy to do you a favour!

:wink:
Nick, kanga liked this
#1663589
Rob P wrote:You can land an RV without a little hop or two? :scratch:

Every day's a school day here at FLYER

Rob P :D


I don't now you have not let me try yet.........

I did manage to tame the Texan taildragger which undercarriage was of similar construction as the RVs, mind you I did not enjoy that aeroplane one bit.

Not so the Auster, that was equally unpleasant to fly and after 1 landing I did have enough of that. Anaemic and noisy piece of wonderful Brit engineering.
#1663593
Wow!

Coming in that fast, I’m surprised you’re not on Neptune!

A wheeler is fine even at 160 kts, but eventually you’ll run out of runway!

I’m only a low timer, but maybe slow it up a bit and you’ll never have a bounce - ever. But to let go of the stick is a brave adage whether three pointing or wheeling it.

Unless an aircraft aerodynamically can’t get airborne by getting its tail wheel off first, it can always land in a three point attitude.

:D
Last edited by TheFarmer on Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
#1663594
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:
JonnyS wrote:What speed does the aeroplane stall at?

If you don't fit in the aeroplane I would be willing to take it off your hands for a suitably small sum, let's face it nobody wants an ill fitting aeroplane and yours looks a very nice one, so happy to do you a favour!

:wink:


I think 43/44kts was the figure from the last permit test flight.

And I'm actually still flying with the seat forward - there's a small seat vs canopy disagreement to overcome before I can recline further! Your concern is noted, though :)
Flyin'Dutch' liked this
#1663601
On not moving the stick - indeed. There is a bit of pilot induced oscillation (PIO) there. Essentially your inputs were over correcting when the stick went light, so when the angle of attack changes and the elevators start working again there is too much input. You notice this so reduce input... The repeated movement multiplies the bounce. This isn't extreme (a few nose wheel aircraft get written off every year when PIO ends with a nose wheel detaching) but still there. Its surprisingly difficult to notice yourself doing it too as we are used to applying constant pressure on a stick rather than holding it at a certain location.
So set attitude on landing, get the speed right, stop playing with the stick.

I did my tailwheel conversion a few months ago. I had the same issue with the stick and didn't have the attitude quite right, causing a bouncing Jodel. Once it clicks you wonder what all the fuss was about! Sounds like you managed to develop bad habits.