[Morten]

I guess in something like a Cessna Aerobat or a Citabria you have traditional doors which in flight would be difficult to open wide enough to get out. So you would hope they have a jettison function which allows e.g. the hinges to come apart.

On other machines which are more adapted for intensive aeros, there doesn't tend to be a door but a canopy which invariably can be jettisoned - including in the T67 which QSD mentions. Indeed, there seems to be quite a long list of such canopies flying off even when they're not meant to as they were not closed and locked properly

I wonder what egress options Bob Hoover had in his Shrike? And whether he was wearing a chute?

[flyguy]

During aerobatic training our students find that they cannot physically pull the stick back for a vertical figure if they haven't cleared the airspace immediately beforehand...

[Merlin83b]

I guess in something like a Cessna Aerobat or a Citabria you have traditional doors which in flight would be difficult to open wide enough to get out. So you would hope they have a jettison function which allows e.g. the hinges to come apart.

The Citabria I used to fly did have a pin through the hinge that could be pulled to detach the door.

[pingmart]

I believe that most serious aerobatic aircraft have provision for getting out. Most do not have doors at all and it is the canopy that goes.

I occasionally practise abandoning our T67 when parked up on the ground, much to the amusement of the diners at the Pilot's Hub. Rehearsing the sequence of events will hopefully make it a bit faster in the event of a real problem. Several survivors of low level bale outs have mentioned the importance of practice. I also brief any passengers or students on the abandonment drill before take off.

Not sure I know what you mean by "qualified to jump solo". AFAIK there is no qualification required to wear an escape parachute. I did enquire about parachute training when I first started aerobatics, but was told that there is little point, since the small round fast opening canopies used for escapes are very different to the sort of canopy you might encounter at a parachute school.

I just assumed you have to be qualified to do any sort of parachute jumping. I haven't looked into whether the escape parachutes require no training or exp.

Also, one or two of the aircrafts I am using for my PPL are Cessna Aerobats and the doors are the traditional ones, the belts are rather old and difficult to completely get rid of with one move - they do detach, but you still have the shoulder straps hanging around you. I have very very limited exp compared to most on here, so I am asking questions hoping to learn something

[Dave W]

I'm slightly amused by the idea that I might choose not to use the emergency parachute on my back because I didn't have a qualification signed up beforehand.

[pingmart]

I'm slightly amused by the idea that I might choose not to use the emergency parachute on my back because I didn't have a qualification signed up beforehand.

Dave, I thought you needed qualification to jump with a parachute, hence my comments.

I still don't assume it's as simple as pull the string, wait to go to the ground and order fish and chips with a beer...

So my theory was -> you need qualification, hence you don't randomly own and carry a parachute

Also, emergency parachutes are normally not on your back, but on your butt

[Dave W]

Ones I've worn have been both seat type and back type. I know what you meant though; it just set up an amusing scenario in my mind.

[PeteSpencer]

I occasionally post videos on FB and other media. They are normally edited to cut out the boring bits between manoeuvres which often means that the evidence of lookout to clear the airspace before a sequence is not shown. It does not mean that there is any lack of lookout.

A quick glance upward just before you start to pull up for a loop will not reveal the person approaching at speed from your six o'clock. Clearing the whole area before starting is better and then looking out during each manoeuvre to clear the space for the next one. A loop is a great way to see all the airspace around you.

Last summer, while on the way to Le Touquet, but still getting a basic service over north Kent from Southend, I suddenly became aware of a creamy CAP like aerobatic monoplane travelling vertically upwards about 200m from my left wingtip (I saw his smoke first), but got a good plan view of him.

I looked up to see him pulling over the top ofthe (I presume) loop above me. I say I presume because I shoved the nose down , opened up the tap and got the hell out of it.

I didn't get his reg and by the time my rectal sphincter had stopped twittering I didn't even bother to tell Southend.

I often wonder if he had done his clearing turns.

And yes, I was over 20 miles from Headcorn.

I guess if I had still been on a traffic service from Southend they might have warned me....

Peter

[davef77]

Does everyone squawk 7004?

Rob P

I do.

[davef77]

NON Aerobatic Pilots - Lookout

Slightly patronised to be honest....
The amount of bumbling bimbling morons who stooge about with their head obviously in a tablet or waving at Aunty Joan whilst orbiting the school sports day.

It’s everyone’s responsibility to look out in every phase of flight.

I see lookout in certain airfield circuits is abysmal. Absolutely abysmal, when combined with poor RT and general lack of situational awareness, it’s a wonder we don’t have more midair collisions.

I came over the apex of a half Cuban once in an AIAA.
I was about 5500 AGL, and saw traffic crossing 90 degrees R-L (well relative to me, being inverted at the time) and at the same level.
It was civvy traffic and both of us were in receipt of a service from the mil traffic unit....I often wondered if I was a few seconds earlier starting my pull up if we’d have had an expensive laundry bill.

One of the reasons I will always wear a chute during aeros. Missing tails or wings caused by unplanned meetings!!

I often see people who don't seem to have seen me when practicing. You can see a Cessna flying through my practice area in this video from about 3:02

I had been flying in this area, exactly the same 1km square patch of sky, for 3 minutes, as you can see from the video. I think it is fairly obvious that the Cessna pilot didn't see me.

Fortunately I saw them with plenty of time to avoid anything nasty.

I fly from White Waltham as do LOTS of other aerobatic pilots. The areas around WW, particularly to the West and South West, are divided up into practice grids and are used regularly for aerobatics. Many of us also fly up to the Vale of Aylesbury (as in this video) sometimes, when the close-in practice areas have already been used.

Please keep a good lookout if you are in the area.

[davef77]

IF you think logically it is very very different and in fact opening the soft top at 80-100 will simply rip it away from the car, it will be something like opening an umbrella the wrong way around against the wind. In my book at least, opening a door while in forward motion at 80-100 will require some Thor powers.

My question still stands please

The answer is pretty simple really, most aerobatic aeroplanes don't have doors!

They have canopies, that as others have said, will be ripped-off if you eject them. They are designed to do this.

[davef77]

I'm slightly amused by the idea that I might choose not to use the emergency parachute on my back because I didn't have a qualification signed up beforehand.

Dave, I thought you needed qualification to jump with a parachute, hence my comments.

I still don't assume it's as simple as pull the string, wait to go to the ground and order fish and chips with a beer...

So my theory was -> you need qualification, hence you don't randomly own and carry a parachute

Also, emergency parachutes are normally not on your back, but on your butt

Sorry, but you have a few misconceptions here.

There is no qualification needed to buy, or use an emergency parachute. Most of the aerobatic pilots that I know, and I know quite a few, don't have experience of jumping even if they carry a chute. They will "take their chances" if ever an event forces it upon them.

Emergency chutes come in all shapes and sizes. back-packs, wedges and back and seat and seat-packs. It is really more down to the aeroplane than the use.

In the use of a chute when UK flying aerobatics is optional. I don't in my current aeroplane, but used to when flying a Pitts.

[Crash one]

I find this sort of thread quite disturbingly patronising.
To assume that another aircraft hasn't seen you because he's got his head down playing with the iPad, is an insult.
I've had passengers see other traffic before I did, I've also been a passenger and seen other traffic that the pilot hasn't seen, "yet".
I'm not an aerobaticalist so that seems to put me in the category of bimbling bumbling moron does it?
As for the parachute jump qualification issue. To even consider mentioning the requirement for a qualification to use it is laughable, I wore one in gliders, I got it repacked because the rest of the group couldn't be bothered after it had sat in a damp trailer for ten years! Never gave a thought to qualifications required. If I'd needed it to replace a missing wing I would have used it.
I could rabbit on but I find it depressing that some pilots think no one else has a brain except them.

[Barcli]

a Cessna flying through my practice area

Its not though is it Dave - Its Class G isnt it ? I think thats whats p****ng people off....

[Maxthelion]

Think how hard it is to pick out a slow moving white Cessna against white clouds, whilst you're flying around. If that Cessna is on a constant relative bearing, i.e. not moving in your field of vision, then it can be very hard to spot.

Now put yourself in that Cessna and look out (because you're not face down in an Ipad) and tell me just how hard is really is to see a bright red and yellow aeroplane constantly changing attitude and altitude, rolling every few seconds, and doing all this whilst confined to a tiny patch of sky 1000m metres cubed, between zero and 200 knots. Bear in mind all these factors mean that the visual target presented will never be on a constant relative bearing and will always be moving in your field of vision.