Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
I am keen to get the IMC to help me get out of trouble but also as the first 15 hrs of a CBIR. The price per hour IMC training at my club is about 1/3 of that being charged by the large ATPL-focused ATOs.

I assume that there is no indication as to how an IR(R) can be credited towards or converted to a BIR once introduced?
I have no information regarding if, whether or how any credits might work.

I would imagine that given instruction towards the issue of the IR(R) can be credited toward training for an IR (via the CB-IR training route) it could be successfully argued that training towards the IR(R) should be counted towards the training for the BIR, but as I say I am guessing so take it with a pinch of salt. Bookworm is best placed to advise on that question.

For those wishing to start training I advocate this text above all others.
Instructor Errant wrote:
simoon wrote:Surely once obtained it can be revalidated post April 2019 just not issued?

Unfortunately no, not on an EASA licence. Strictly speaking the UK CAA will still be able to issue an IMC rating [note not an IR(R)] to a UK CAA PPL but the only aircraft that you could exercise the priviledges on would be non-EASA/Annex 2 aircraft and I am not sure how many/if any are approved for flight under IFR in IMC.

I am even more worried now. I accept the argument that the IMC training is good even without the rating. However, I don’t want to spend £3k and a week of my time getting a “rating” only to lose it less than a year later. I am seriously thinking of postponing my training until the way forward becomes clearer. If anyone has any more info then I would be grateful to hear it.
Instructor Errant wrote:
simoon wrote:Surely once obtained it can be revalidated post April 2019 just not issued?

Unfortunately no, not on an EASA licence.

I was not aware of that. Can you please point at the regulations that clarify an IR(R) cannot be revalidated/renewed for an EASA licence post April 2019.

If true, some aircraft owners that did their 8.33 kHz upgrade to have modern IMC capability (i.e. GPS/Nav/Com) that would be legal for GPS approaches are going to be very unhappy and wish they had fitted just a basic 8.33 kHz radio and saved a huge amount of money better spent on actual flying.
I cannot offer a definitive regulation and only the rather weaker reflection of discussions with CAA management which have been clear that the mechanism to attached the authorisation to an EASA Part-FCL licence ends in April 2019 (8th not 30th as per earlier assertion).

However, if you look at IN-2016/082 it is true to say that it talks only of 'issuing' of the rating. It would be good to get the view of Tony Rapson, CAA and the DfT because April 2019 is not far away and if there is not appetite for pushing for this clarification it won't happen. A fellow forumite has offered to elicit a response and I'll report back.
There are 2 scenarios to consider for renewal of an IR(R) after 8th April 2019:

(a) if a lapsed IR(R) rating has not been moved to the section of previously held ratings.

(b) If a lapsed IR(R) rating has been moved to the section of previously held ratings (because the licence has been re-issued for some reason since the rating expired).

For (a) there is no need to issue the licence following a successful renewal test, so there is no need for a process to attach the rating to an EASA Part FCL licence, so that might be ok? (will have to wait for your response from the CAA).

For (b) the licence would need to be re-issued with the rating moved to the valid ratings section of the licence, and the suggestion is following 8th April 2019 there is no authorisation to issue an EASA Part FCL licence to add the IR(R) rating. i.e. the rating might not be available after that date (to be confirmed).
I have emailed my MP, copied Grant Shapps and CAA. I would have copied AOPA as well but they hide behind a contact form (in general, I am an AOPA member and supporter but contact forms are one of many pet peeves):


As a constituent I wish to raise with you a matter of aviation safety. I have copied this email your colleague Grant Shapps in his role as chair of the APPG on General Aviation and to a relevant email address at the UK Civil Aviation Authority.

For more than forty years, UK private pilots have been able to gain a unique live-saving extension to their licences which allows them to be licensed to use skills to enhance the safety of their flying in the capricious maritime climate of the British Isles. Originally called the Instrument Meteorological Rating and now called the Instrument Rating (Restricted), according to a CAA information notice issued in 2016, this rating will no longer be available from April 2019, to the detriment of the safety of UK pilots.

I ask that you raise this matter with the UK CAA.

Thank you
And don't forget the BIR can only be taught at ATO's not DTO/RTF's. Which dispite my local school have two IRI on the books and one IRR/E they won't be able to teach it. Which means it's a nice 104 mile round trip to my nearest ATO. Great.
joe-fbs wrote:That implies no BIR before mid-2020 so a potential gap of more than a year.

Very good point and the reason I have been explaining to my IMCers to renew or revalidate as close to 8th April 2019 so they can enjoy the priviledges for 25 months until 31st May 2021 which will, hopefully, bridge the gap.