[Jonzarno]

used to be a case of turning up before doors open, get a ticket, register on a screen then sit about for three hours

I believe chair rental is currently around £200 per hour.

Is that a wet or a dry rate?

[tomshep]

Depends how long they keep you waiting.

[Bob Upanddown]

The situation has changed beyond recognition. You now need to register, book in advance and pay an obscene amount of money.

Details here - £25 I think is what they’ll do you for. It’s £100 for a licence application. Thieving gits

Not the situation, but the CAA in general.

It will soon be impossible to deal with the CAA without paying £xxx's.

[defcribed]

And we should be glad to pay it, right, because it's the cream of the crop that work there? Their time spent dealing with us is rightly incredibly expensive, because they are the employer of choice for the best and the brightest, the most talented who need to be paid top dollar to be retained.

They wouldn't last five minutes if what they did was subject to a competitive market place. Note that this observation is separate from the idea that aviation regulation should be subject to competitive marketplace (privatised), which I am not suggesting at all.

[flybymike]

I hereby announce that the FAA (Flybymike Aviation Authority) is henceforth able to provide a completely regulation free environment at zero cost.

[PeteSpencer]

Just to put this one to bed:
I telephoned the CAA yesterday , on the strength of this thread, to make an appointment:
The Lady said there weren't any appointments till April 29th.
'That's fine' said I 'my deadline's October'
CAA: 'That will be £100 please'
Me : Splutter: ' You mean in addition to the £44 quoted on the form?'
CAA: 'Yes'
Me' You mean £144 just to look at my passport, my gas bill and my licence to confirm its me standing before you, then write as much on the form I've already filled in for you.?'
CAA: Well you can send it in by post'
Me: ' But I've got to be there in person and I'm certainly not putting my passport in the post'
CAA: Well You can get an examiner to authenticate a photo copy'
Me: Lightbulb moment 'Hang on a minute we're not talking about the same thing'. please can I speak to your line manager.
CAA: Oh I'll put you onto my supervisor'
Supervisor: Can I Help?'
Me: explained need to be there in person for licence verification and disbelief at two charges.
Supervisor: Sorry about problem there should be no charge for attending (£100) just for the SRG 2110 paperwork(£44). There is no need for an appointment just come to the desk and I confirm you won't be turned away.Because it is us asking you to attend, we neither require appt or payment.
Me: Thank you very much Could I ask you please to put that in an email to me.
Supervisor: Certainly, I'll just double check with my Dept Manager-break-break- Yes its as I said email on the way.
Me TVM. Email printed off

This morning Arr CAA Desk 10.00hrs:
Reception ' I can't let you in if you haven't got an appointment'
Me ' I phoned yesterday and was told I don't need an appointment and here's the confirmatory email:'
Reception-Let me take that email for a minute: four phone calls later: OK I'll let you in(prints off electronic pass)
Three minute wait: Nice chap comes down from upstairs, fully briefed (but also surprised an appt was not needed), Takes off my SRG2110 and ID stuff for photocopying, returns five minutes later and says CAA will send stuff direct to FAA.
Jobs a good 'un.

Comments:1) The desk bloke (contractor, not CAA staff)showed me the list of morning's appointments: there were FOUR. -no wonder there's a waiting list.
2) The actual need for an appointment seemed ill understood in different depts, My email clinched it, so make your mind up how you'll play it if you need to go down for verification purposes.Don't know what the reception desk outcome would have been without email proof.
3) Finally my grateful thanks to A., the delightful lady in licensing assessment who went the extra mile and to D. who dropped everything and came down to sort my application this morning.

Peter

[kanga]

..
Comments:1) The desk bloke (contractor, not CAA staff)..

'nuff said ?

[Bob Upanddown]

Reception ' I can't let you in if you haven't got an appointment'
Me ' I phoned yesterday and was told I don't need an appointment and here's the confirmatory email:'
Reception-Let me take that email for a minute: four phone calls later: OK I'll let you in(prints off electronic pass)
Three minute wait: Nice chap comes down from upstairs, fully briefed (but also surprised an appt was not needed),

This is another problem at the CAA, happens all the time and why that all important email is always required.

It is symptomatic of a business where costs have been cut and no-one who understands the business is left facing the customer. And because even the front line staff can't talk to anyone who knows what to do, they make up stuff.

And we should be glad to pay it, right, because it's the cream of the crop that work there?

The people who work there are, by and large, good people but working in a system that is fundementally flawed. If you want to point fingers start with the CEO.

[Flying_john]

Good bit of primary research by Pete S , however I am left with an unanswered question.

Presumeably people with An "orville wright" plastic US licence obtained as a piggy back to their UK PPL(A) and with the CAA pppwxyz/ab number referenced on that piggy back licence still have a valid USA licence to fly.

Why would that not still be a valid licence if you kept your UK PPL(A) running concurrently when changing to an EASA licence.

I did, and I am not expecting a difficulty when next visiting the USA and renting an aircraft, in the same way as it was no problem last year.

But if there is a problem - can someone explain what it is - because I still dont understand what the issue is ?

[Dave W]

I will try.

The issue is that if you apply for and receive a white replacement to e.g. your old Brown CAA licence then the format of the licence number changes.

(We are talking about the entire licence number - not just the '123456K' CAA reference that is part of the licence number string.)

The 61.75 certificate is (according to the FAA, quoted on the CAA website) only valid if the number format on their certificate exactly matches the UK licence number format printed on the licence you are currently using.

Once you've received the replacement white licence, your old brown licence isn't valid anymore.

Therefore if your 61.75 certificate quotes the brown licence number format, then the 61.75 certificate isn't valid either.

So long as the licence you use - whether it is an EASA PPL, a white UK PPL, or a Brown UK PPL - has a number format exactly the same as that on your 61.75 certificate then that should be OK.

(But: There's remaining uncertainty about whether a UK PPL after 8 April (whether white or brown) is valid to fly aircraft in the USA that in Europe would be "EASA aircraft". See this thread. I don't believe there's a definitive FAA position on that yet, and they may not even have been asked.)

[Rob P]

Finally my grateful thanks to A., the delightful lady in licensing assessment who went the extra mile and to D. who dropped everything

Things are looking up

Rob P

[Flying_john]

Thankyou DaveW - all clear now to check the format !

I'm not sure the rental FBO is going to know the intricacies of numbering formats on UK licences though

[GrahamB]

I'm not sure the rental FBO is going to know the intricacies of numbering formats on UK licences though

They don’t have to, all they need in mind is that the FAA have ruled that numbers of any foreign licence presented along with that of the 61.75 must match. Exactly.

If you do have to update your 61.75 you might as well change it to match the EASA licence, which removes all doubt about the post-8th April question.

[Dave W]

If anybody reading this does think you need to change then be aware that after October this year it won't be possible to do it without going to the USA.

https://www.caa.co.uk/General-aviation/ ... -licences/

[PeteSpencer]

I can’t understand why people are constantly trying to buck the system . The 61.75 re-issue requirements have been well documented and the CAA has provided a smooth( ish) pathway via SRG2110 to do it all in UK before the October cut off DaveW mentions.

No need to bugger about with heart searching over what validity the moribund poo brown will eventually have ,if any and how to hoodwink the Feds, just get a EASA PPL licence number and get that transferred to your 61.75 .The CAA pretty much spoon feeds you all the way And the FAA sends the new certificate directly to your door, no charge.