Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
#1576529
ivor.phillips wrote:..
the Boeing should have had a PAWS fitted :lol:
..!


And a FLARM .. :)

I'm guessing (with all the background knowledge of a 50-year day/VFR bimbler :roll: ) that a 737, still only at 2500', may well also have been manoeuvring, eg for Airways join.
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#1576533
ivor.phillips wrote:both Aircraft took appropriate avoiding action with presumably the smaller aircraft taking the most, to me that's a normal flying day around the south east,
the Boeing should have had a PAWS fitted :lol:
sorry i couldn't resist!

The 737 pilot took avoiding action to the left instead of the right which is not in accordance with the Rules Of The Air. (Sorry i couldn't resist!)
Last edited by Talkdownman on Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
#1576536
Talkdownman wrote:
ivor.phillips wrote:both Aircraft took appropriate avoiding action with presumably the smaller aircraft taking the most, to me that's a normal flying day around the south east,
the Boeing should have had a PAWS fitted :lol:
sorry i couldn't resist!

The 737 pilot took avoiding action to the left instead of the right which is not in accordance with the Rules Of The Air. (Sorry i couldn't resist!)




.......with at least 100kts over overtake, I would suggest that left was the only sensible option.

PS. Pity the other aircraft didn't have Mode-S ES/ADS-B/TCAS. :lol:
#1576540
Dave Phillips wrote:I would suggest that left was the only sensible option

On 'biennials' I like my 'trainees' to do one or two avoiding action exercises to see if they do a positive steep turn and to see what direction they do it in. Interestingly I find that a lot of Brits turn the 'wrong' way without realising. Rules of the Road seem to be a natural instinct in the air without a thought for ROTA.

GolfHotel wrote:I see an application for more CAS in our 12 o’clock

If that 737 had been an IFR airways-join King Air would you be saying the same?
#1576542
GolfHotel wrote:I see an application for more CAS in our 12 o’clock.

Although it may be the case that ADSB out from the Cessna would have enabled an earlier warning from the TCAS

Where do you get 'Cessna' from. There's no mention of it being a Cessna in the AIRPROX report.
Is there something you're not telling us? :twisted:
Workload permitting, in cases like this Heathrow and/or Gatwick have asked Farnborough to track the unknown aircraft as with their multiple radar sources, they would have more chance of following a 'primary only' contact. Were the '737 crew unable to give even a basic description ie colour, whether high or low wing etc?
#1576544
Talkdownman wrote:On 'biennials' I like my 'trainees' to do one or two avoiding action exercises to see if they do a positive steep turn and to see what direction they do it in. Interestingly I find that a lot of Brits turn the 'wrong' way without realising. Rules of the Road seem to be a natural instinct in the air without a thought for ROTA.


Done it myself. Returning to Denham one day I spotted an opposite direction outbound and started a left turn, but immediately thought NO and turned right instead. The other guy didn't turn at all, but at least, as TDM says, I followed ROA which is ultra important in Class G.
As they were converging, the rule in this case is that the aircraft which has the other on its right shall give way, so the onus was on the 737 to avoid and they apparently took the correct action, as it would appear the unknown turned right and just about reversed course when it should actually have 'maintained its course and speed'.
Had the 737 been receiving a radar service however the controller would almost certainly have instructed a right turn in order to track behind the unknown.
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By Irv Lee
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1576552
I remember arriving at Popham to find a well known south based instructor still white and shaking mildly thirty minutes after nearly embedding himself into the side of a 757 on approach to Lasham for maintenance. Apparently as he exited the clouds, transponder off as usual, radio listening to Popham all the way through intermittent imc from "whence he came", to see the 757 in his windscreen. He claimed the nose and tail were in very different direction viewed through the windscreen. If I said the winds were easterly, and there was nominative determinism involved, no doubt some would work it out, but don't write it here!
#1576596
Talkdownman wrote:The 737 pilot took avoiding action to the left instead of the right which is not in accordance with the Rules Of The Air. (Sorry i couldn't resist!)

Except when 2 aircraft are converging - the aircraft which has the other one on its right shall give way.
The unknown was on the 737s right.