FLYER Forums

shortwing wrote:I do hope that airspace depiction is not true, it never had more than an ATZ before and unless traffic really ramps up doesn't need more.

One of the criteria the D f T looks at is number of passengers using it; if it's freight only there won't be any hence no CAS.

Maybe they can extend Crossrail out there. Put on a "high speed" service to Heathrow.

oakworth wrote:You just answered your own question. Of course they are answerable, they need planning permission.

You get planning permission by putting forward a proposition that meets a set of objective and defined criteria laid out in the National Planning Policy Framework and the local plan published by the relevant council. Neither of these contain anything about businesses not being allowed to make U-turns or closing airports when they said they wouldn't.

These people have relatively deep pockets and play a long game. They may even open it for a period of time. But if they do so then it'll be with an unspoken plan to declare it non-viable and close it again after making a show of trying. This will come after they have carefully studied the council's criteria (and precedent) for granting change of use on the basis of a business not being viable.

I know quite a lot about this stuff. Along with a couple of other folks I picked through the minutae of planning policy and made our council reverse its approval of a change of use application (to residential) for our village pub. The then-owners bought it for a knock-down price and made a realistic show of losing lots of money despite trying really hard before making their application to suddenly own the cheapest 5-bedroom house in Warwickshire (£250k pub, £1m house) which they would of course immediately sell.

So it can be thwarted. But the central argument about benefit to the community is much easier to make for a village pub than a massive disused airfield.

Paul_Sengupta wrote:Maybe they can extend Crossrail out there. Put on a "high speed" service to Heathrow.

Great idea, but if HS2 is anything to go by. Alternatively connect up to the existing Ramsgate HS1 service. Build a station near Manston Road, run a shuttle bus service to the airport. Probably one bendy bus could do the route every 10 minutes.

ConcordeBA wrote:Probably one bendy bus could do the route every 10 minutes.

Until it catches fire

Paul_Sengupta wrote:Maybe they can extend Crossrail out there. Put on a "high speed" service to Heathrow.

There's been talk for a long time about 'Manston Parkway' railway station - spur off the Canterbury to Ramsgate line. Great but the trains only go High Speed from Ashford so its going to be an hour fifteen from STP which is rubbish.

If it's mostly cargo, does speed matter that much?

Honestly don't think the various stakeholders and politicians concerned have the foggiest clue about the costs or reinstating Manston as an approved CAP 168 or EASA-Certificated airport, hosting the big cargo jets they want to see. Everything was flogged-off when it was sold, everything has to be reinstated, upgraded from scratch. Nothing is compliant. What you have to assume is that the starting point is that fundamentally all you have is a whopping great piece of tarmac alone and every other single element has to be re-established from scratch, approved, certified. Up-front infrastructure/capital costs will be mind-blowing and then ongoing operational costs and airfield maintenance, compliance etc. will be huge. Whatever business model is being tabled, the numbers will never stack-up without a massive amount of non-aviation-related land-development cash coming in - housing, business parks, warehousing - whatever. It would be wonderful to have another airport back into the fold, but there are some serious dreamers out there without a clue of the realities. Very, very deep pockets required and a very long term return on the investment if solely aviation oriented.

pullup wrote:I’m afraid I agree with the previous poster....

Can anyone name any airport/ airfield that has been re-opened after a long closure?

Im afraid this is another Plymouth/Panshangar.

Two replies so far Colitishall and Doncaster. Both ex military surplus airfields, so not what I was asking.

Again anyone know of any “airport / airfield” that has reopened after a long closure?

pullup wrote:

pullup wrote:I’m afraid I agree with the previous poster....

Can anyone name any airport/ airfield that has been re-opened after a long closure?

Im afraid this is another Plymouth/Panshangar.

Colitishall and Doncaster. Both ex military surplus airfields, so not what I was asking.

Is Bedford open as a GA airfield? I cannot find anything on it.

EGBF Bedford is very much alive and well. Owned and operated by MotorSport Vision.

I have family <5 miles from Sheffield, Plymouth and Manston. All three have closed during my flying days.
I selfishly have been very unhappy about it. I don't see it as progress there's always somewhere to build houses, Not so easy to replace this kind of infrastructure.
I'm rooting for Manston. Even If GA fees are high, I'll still have a choice.

But the last time I looked, which admittedly was some time ago, Bedford was only available to those visiting for business purposes.

znww5 wrote:But the last time I looked, which admittedly was some time ago, Bedford was only available to those visiting for business purposes.

Yes - and very nice it is too I would recommend a visit - their track days are great!

Flyingfemme wrote:

znww5 wrote:But the last time I looked, which admittedly was some time ago, Bedford was only available to those visiting for business purposes.

Yes - and very nice it is too I would recommend a visit - their track days are great!

At £50 landing fee for a single, and £100 for a twin, I’m not so sure.